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  #61  
Old 02-21-2008, 07:03 PM
Tom Stock
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve-O View Post
Here is something to chew on. Just got off the phone with Brian May. Did you know he works at Howard Park with the park system. Anyways, he spoke with the supervisor of the park and the only reason there is no kiting aloud at Howard was due to people kiting in the swim zones. No accident, noswimmers that got hurt, no notta. Just an out of town tourists riding in the swimzone on a crowded sunny day and ruining it for all.

So, Brian is putting together a petition that we would like everyone to sign at the race to get Howard Park open again to kiting. We got nothing to lose.

So we are all concerned about beach access in the future, so use Howard as an example that access can be easily taken away and very difficult to get back.

We all need your help on this one whether you ride there or not.

There are some rumors about Howard, and there is the story straight from the supervisors mouth.
same story I heard. good news, hope it works out.
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  #62  
Old 02-22-2008, 12:13 PM
Tom Stock
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Tags are primarily up to the instructors so we can't answer that question. Signs? We already said yes and agreed on the sign it just never got done.

I guess we could dig up the thread and see who dropped the ball.

You discussed self rescue courses which is a good idea to keep lines contained during the swim in. Wasn't there a big self rescue class at E.B. awhile back? I can't remember but I know they were scheduled two or three times with a bunch of people signed up.

The big issue now is bans and that appears to be happening due to disregarding swim areas so I'd like to hear some ideas on how kite-4-life could address this issue.
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  #63  
Old 02-22-2008, 12:56 PM
Woodson Woodson is offline
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Default Taken from Kiteforum

I took this from the discussion on Kiteforum regarding rash guards that indicate community member etc...


“It looks like the Brits have had this sorted out for a long time:

http://www.britishkitesurfingassociatio ... ory/16/35/

I think a good first step could be the formation of local clubs where the riders are easily identified i.e. by a rash guard. This give some small amount of incentive for club members to behave in the public eye. And when an incident happens hopefully it involves a non-member. The existance of a club lays groundwork to allow some responsible kiters to keep access when disrespectful kiters ruin the sports reputation. Hopefully then the worst case scenerio is enforced club membership in order to maintain access as in Ainsdale:

http://www.aoskc.com/page.php?2

Behavior like this needs to have consequences for the kiter for example exclusion from the club:



Jake”


_

Bryan W.
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  #64  
Old 02-22-2008, 01:48 PM
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amber amber is offline
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The rash guards sound cool, but good luck trying to get everyone to wear the same thing. ha ha.

the tags we agreed on are cheap (less than two bucks a piece when ordered in quantities of 100), waterproof, durable, and have a place to put emergency contact information, which IMO is a very important benefit.

They would be attached to your harness that way when switching kites, boards, etc. you wouldn't have to remember to change anything. people would forget bracelets, etc. We agreed on three levels and three colors. I've got the catalog at my desk. HOWEVER... i am a broke joke and cannot do this alone. I know that Steve isn't Daddy Warbucks either, so that is why having all the instructors pitch in was the most realistic plan. Members of the community can also volunteer to donate. Like i said...they're not expensive, but someone has to be willing to throw in some dough.

maybe we could set up a bucket at the race post party or something for donations and see how that works out. I'm sure most people would be willing to throw in a couple bucks and with more than 100 people registered, it would cover the entire cost.

gotta go fight fraud. happy friday. what do you guys think?
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Last edited by amber; 02-22-2008 at 07:36 PM.
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  #65  
Old 02-22-2008, 02:02 PM
rigger rigger is offline
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Default Crap

I think all this is ridiculous. Why would you want to strangle us with all this talk of getting the authorities involved? Preventive or whatever, and having them regulate us? Friggin crazy…Stupid and ill thought. If you want to be so regulated and excessively safe go to the water park in Orlando and ride around in circles for hours.

You cannot compare our area with Miami or FT Lauderdale. Ricks and Neils problems are far worse than ours will ever be. We do not have the attention or population on our beaches. I ride outside and inside the markers and will continue to do so, because I am aware of my surrounds and will not go near people in the water or on shore. I fear it. This should be common sense. And I KNOW most share this common sense. Honestly, how many bystander casualties have you heard of in this area, ever? Non-to my knowledge, and that shows that most of us are conscious of safety, and that we are doing something right. Most of our worries lie with new kiters, the occasional kook, and launching and landing our kites. None of which riding out side the markers will help. Its really a handful that are on some self righteous mission to regulate the entire community because a noob made a noob mistake and got dragged or lofted or just banged up or just did something plan stupid. There is nothing we can do about a wannabe who bought a kite off eBay.

All we can do is put the word out that lessons are as important as a kite, and that is when Randy, Steve O, Eckerd’s and the rest of the local instructors who have an obligation to our community for their part in instruction of safety and related matter. Sorry but there is a risk you take in this game when starting out, and thru ones kiting life, and regulation aren’t going to help that. Shit is going to happen regardless of what kind of regulation you are trying to shove down our throats. And expect for a few choice spots, we are not endanger of losing anything atm. Which also says something. We could us people like Scott, Tom and Steve 0 Steve and the few others that are active in promoting kiting when our access is threaten, and to be our spokesmen when or if some kook or kitemare does threaten our access. But all this getting the authorities involves is not the answer and you are pissing on the freedom this sport offers. Do use all a favor and back off the “let the authorities regulate us crap.” Help out, advise new kiters.
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  #66  
Old 02-22-2008, 02:27 PM
<jason
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Here's the thing...

I personally wouldnt mind wearing some sort of rashguard or little tag hanging off my harness....

But rigger is right, once we go down that road....of having someone else regulate us... thats what we will get Regulations....
And their will be no comming back from that...

I understand this is not a soultion, just my .02
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  #67  
Old 02-22-2008, 02:55 PM
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amber amber is offline
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let me clear something up. The idea of the tags was to prevent "the authorities" regulate us by being proactive and taking care of things ourselves. It is to avoid "them" having to become involved. Its an easy way to promote safety, and give others an idea of who they're on the water and beach with.

I personally get all panicky when someone rides really close to me. Even though people know who i am, they might all not realize that i should have a yellow tag because i'm still learning. That kook with the ebay kite and no lessons would have no tag which would be an alert to area riders.

Rigger... not sure who you are, and that would probably help, but blatantly stating that you don't care and you don't think anything bad will happen is just plain careless. if you care about this sport and the future of it in our area, be a big boy and stay outside swim markers unless its 40 degrees out and there is no one out there.

I think that your mentality in dealing with the authorities via PR people AFTER something bad happens is absolutely ridiculous. sorry... it is. You act as if you're invincible. I don't know who you are so i don't know how you ride, but let me tell you that you can be a kiter as good as Billy or Matt or Mike, be riding thru a swim zone with kids in it, be in total control and have a line snap, a chicken loop accidentally release, etc. Shit... Tomstock had a freaking BIRD hit his bridle and snap it.

Its a risky sport. We try to do what we can to lower the risk level. If this includes putting a luggage tag on your harness and you're not okay with at least discussing that, maybe you need to find other places to ride so your arrogance and ignorance doesn't cause me to loose a great place to ride.
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Last edited by amber; 02-22-2008 at 07:39 PM. Reason: grammar
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  #68  
Old 02-22-2008, 03:06 PM
Tom Stock
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I see your point but we are already regulated by the authorities. We are just getting away with it because our numbers are still low and there hasn't been a serious accident yet.... but there have been PLENTY of accidents on the beach with bystanders. I've seen my share.

When the crowds increase and we DO have that one bad accident expect your beach launch days to be history, just like Howard Park. All it takes is ONE accident. Look how much attention the power line lofting got and poor Chris didn't even hurt a bystander. With all of the "Dangerous sport?" headlines imagine if he HAD hurt someone else?

Sorry I'm not being a spokesperson for anyone "after the fact". Tough luck on that one. Thats like telling someone not to do something and then cleaning up for them after they blatantly do it anyway.

I'd rather just quit kiteboarding when that happens than clean up after a bunch of egotistical careless self centered kiteboarders (obviously this doesn't include everyone).


Honestly I can't believe nobody can even agree to stay outside a swim area. That is about as rediculous,self centered, and irresponsible as it gets. It's just one thing and it's something we are already supposed to be doing.

Forget the newbs who don't know any better. The real kook is the one who DOES know better and does it anyway...

Also, I am not talking about a few tacks inside the buoys. I am talking about blatantly jumping and riding 10 feet from shore in and around swimmers. Everyone tacks inside the swim area one in awhile just like we all speed once in awhile. There is a difference between pushing it and outright disregard.
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  #69  
Old 02-22-2008, 05:45 PM
Skyway Scott
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I got to ride today. It was definitely a nice day. It's amazing how clean the water is getting year to year. Visibility today reminded me of the keys or something. 20 years ago it was basically pea soup out there.

It's cool to see all the viewpoints on here. It's interesting for sure.
After today I decided that I am going to focus on myself and how I ride. I literally don't care what others do anymore. Attempting to change views is a waste of time, so I won't do it. I think Tammy saw how I will interact with/as a part of the community today. A new guy showed up and asked about me about the rules at PaG. I said "just mimic everyone else and you are good to go". Majority rules, basically.

So, I am just going to focus on me. To that end, I want it understood that I have zero intent of making a video (pointless), talking to any authorities (pointless) or doing anything. I just don't want to be "the guy" that screwed us over, so I am going to ride outside the swim zone, regardless of what others do.

The main reason I want to make it clear that I am not focusing on the rest of you is that when/if we lose access, I don't want one person thinking even for a second that I was somehow involved. It's not going to take someone talking, it's only going to take further bad behavior. So, if a ban happens, trust me, I didn't talk to anyone up to this point and won't. Anyone concerned about myself approaching authorities has my word on it that I won't. Only a fool would talk to the beach police at this point and risk being blamed if something bad happens soon.
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  #70  
Old 02-22-2008, 05:55 PM
rigger rigger is offline
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Amber first thing is im not egotist. Im being a realist. And my point is that we are going to shoot our selfs in the foot. My thoughts were a collection of what i read on this thread. I don’t think I addressed anything you mention in your posts. I respect how active you are in the kiting community. And i think you to be sweet, well until you bashed me Oh and Ive been discussing this shit for years. If we all rode in the same spot, then we could possible enforce some kind of the stuff mentioned. But the fact of the matter is that we dont. I would gladly were a luggage tag if it made you feel safer. Oh and this is Jeff Btw

Tom, my point is that most us practice as safe riders.. All this regulation stuff usually comes up after one incident occurs usually with a new kiter, which is also far and few between. I would gladly wear a luggage tag if it made you feel safer too. That’s not my point. My point is that I enjoy riding in the gulf most of all and the meager waves that we get. And when i read about people wanting to video tape people on the beach and have the authorities make our regulation all because someone is riding inside the markers, it irks me. I don’t pull kite loops 10ft from shore, im talking about tacking in and out and playing in the waves, I don’t think its unsafe, If you call that selfcenter than oh well buddy,because we ALL do it. That is my point.
If you really see something unsafe, (beating died horse) Then say something. If they dont listen call the authorites like OS did. Keep all the super regulation stuff at EB were the masses gather and the real possibly of a serious accident occurring. Most times even on a windy day, i can count the amount of kites in the air from coast to coast on one hand. Us riding inside the marks has never been an issue, please dont make it one. I guess thats all im really saying.
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