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  #1  
Old 10-15-2007, 10:50 AM
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A-Bomb A-Bomb is offline
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Post Kicked out of Ft. DeSoto for 6 months!!!

...That's what you'll be if you're not driving out of the Fort DeSoto Park by sunset. Just a heads up for you all.

I was almost given a citation last night by a very upset Park Ranger. She said "We've been warning you guys every weekend, I'm giving you a citation". I think the only thing that saved me was that I said I had not been warned and I was polite to her. I told her I'd post it on here. I don't think I'll take any chances in the future. They're not messing around.
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Old 10-15-2007, 11:16 AM
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Amen to that. As soon as the sun hits the treeline we should already be packin. Let's not F*CK with this simple request.
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Old 10-15-2007, 11:32 AM
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I agree. The park has been very good to us over the years, so let's comply with this simple request and keep them happy.

Be safe

Last edited by kite-4-life; 10-17-2007 at 08:24 PM.
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  #4  
Old 10-15-2007, 12:38 PM
popeye
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Speaking of lessons I saw a lesson going on furthest down wind against the trees and shoreline in the corner.

I think they were just trying to stay out of the way but like Steve was saying, the sand bar is really the place to go.... (way up wind) ... you can usually walk half way to backside skyway along the sandbar and hardly anyone rides over there because they can't be seen by the spectators.

Last edited by popeye; 10-16-2007 at 01:45 PM.
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  #5  
Old 10-15-2007, 09:00 PM
bayflite bayflite is offline
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the racoonz get tagged @ night by carz and the ranger prolly hate2 scrape up coon guts.
i know i would.
i hit one one night.
poor little fella.
if you ever camped at Ft desoto then you know about the coonz.
its >>their<< park
l8r
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don't taze me bro
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  #6  
Old 10-15-2007, 09:06 PM
Skyway Scott
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Good thing the rangers are smart enough to enforce rules on people individually.
It'll be interesting to see the fine and consequences of staying after dark.

I was told by Mr. Wilson (Wolfie was there) that kiters will be treated as individuals at Ft. DeSoto, should he need to take any enforcement action, just as he enforces rules on individual kayakers, fisherman, etc.
I actually made a point of asking this specific question. He gave me a very strong impression that he realized most kiters were cool and we wouldn't be punished as a group if a few really screwed up (staying late isn't really screwing up, but it's not so cool when asked repeatedly to leave). When you think about it, that only makes sense to enforce the rules on those breaking them.

It would be nice if all kiters were more respectful of rules, etc., but I wouldn't worry about him or his staff over-reacting and punishing the whole group.
I also wouldn't underestimate his power in terms of what he can control within in the park, i.e... you can't come in anymore if you break the rules.
Either way, if you are not breaking any rules, I wouldn't worry.

Thing is, would the rangers have a better vibe and view of us all if we followed their requests, and might this help us down the road? That's kind of a no brainer. Too bad it will probably come to someone getting some sort of citation or temporary ban.

Last edited by Skyway Scott; 10-15-2007 at 10:15 PM.
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  #7  
Old 10-16-2007, 10:37 AM
Skyway Scott
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Steve, (this post was actually originally made in response to several posts from Steve, all of which were subsequently deleted).



I hear what you are saying about one kiter reflecting upon the group.
In areas where people might have never seen kiting, the kiter(s) they do see serve as a first impression and can strongly influence how they view our sport. This happens a lot at the beach, especially this time of year, with tourists. Some have never seen the "ocean" (Gulf), let alone a kiter. So for many people, every kiter has the ability to strongly influence that individual's impression of the sport.

I think at EB, the tourists that show up there and watch us are just as impressionable, and what they see that day, is what they know. If they see a kitemare, they believe kiting to be dangerous. If they see.... you get it.
The thing is, we have SO much time in at EB and have left so many good impressions on Jim Wilson and his staff over the years, that I don't think much could happen to change Jim Wilson's over-all impression of us. As a group, we have already proven ourselves to be no more dangerous or disrespectful than any other group that utilizes the park. I believe that at Fort DeSoto, more than any spot we ride, we have progressed beyond being viewed/judged as a group, and predjudicial decisions won't be made against the group as a whole (total ban unlikely). I was confident of this when I first approached Mr. Wilson several years ago, otherwise I wouldn't have gone in to talk with him. This was a while back, but you might remember him actually posting on Tom's forum, jokingly calling himself "The Man" and telling us that all was basically cool, and that permits for events weren't a problem. I do remember a time when there was a group of us afraid to even talk with the rangers, for fear of a bad outcome.
Those days are ancient history .

Fort DeSoto is therefore an exception to rule (of being judged/banned as a group) imo, because the main guy is reasonable and has a clear understanding of the situation.

So many other areas don't have "a main guy" that has a history with riders and a realistic impression of kiting, in general. These are the areas that concern me. Jim Wilson's job is literally to attempt to make sure as many people as possible utilize and are happy with Ft. DeSoto park. He takes that obligation seriously, that benefits us.

That's not the purpose of the DOT at the SW, or the police that patrol the beaches. The primary job of DOT is to insure safety to motorists. Therefore, the SW is a spot we could lose exceptionally quickly, imo, if another kite enters the interstate.
I have been riding the SW quite a bit lately, btw (I wouldn't have guessed this would be the case 2 months ago).
Most riders are practicing pretty safe riding over there, and I have seen a fairly limited number of incidents. Most incidents I did witness were from skilled riders hot dogging near shore, not new riders.

At the SW right now, it would appear that self-regulation is "ready to go". What I mean by that is that no talks/situations have happened recently, but several riders are expressing intentions of being ready, if the need arise.
These are laid back, rational guys/gals approaching me and telling me that they want to insure a safe riding area. It hasn't been necessary to say anything, but it's nice to know most riders out there are trying to stay safe.

One thing that has concerned me recently, and in the past, is an observation I made within only a few months of kiting. The observation that some riders will call those of us who care about safety and maintaining access to spots "haters, nannies, etc", instead of just trying to resolve the issues and work as a team to find a solution/compromise. It's easier to label and walk away, than step it up and attempt to work on things.
Unfortunately, all that the approach of calling some riders "haters" does is split riders in two groups, polarize, lessen communication and accomplish nothing. It'd be nice to get out of this mindset, if possible.

This comes back to some other observations I have noticed.
This scenario with the lessons at EB that day that you guys are mentioning.
Why is it on here? Why wasn't it addressed out there? It sounds like you guys agree it was a bad scenario. Well, talking about protecting an area is fine and all, but someone ultimately has to do something if you see the blatantly wrong occuring. Grab a buddy or two and go into action.
Are we not doing this for fear of being called a hater or not being cool?
I suspect this is the case, and it's understandable. Still, I think at some point we just have to get over it and do what we know is right.
There are things that are obvious on occassion, I feel we need to have the heart to approach in these situations and talk with those involved. I am not pointing the finger, just trying to open up conversation more and figure out what could have been differently.

Not too long ago I approached an instructor giving a lesson on a C kite at Lassing in 25 to 30 knots about 75 yards upwind of trees in nearly onshore conditions. The guy receiving the lesson didn't even have on a helmet. Both instructor and student were getting lifted from the water in the gusts. It was obviously a bad situation, and I didn't really need to ponder too long before talking to the instructor.
I asked the instructor to put a helmet on the guy, he said no, I asked again, he said no, I got in his face, he stopped - that's the short version.

I didn't really mention it until now, but when I heard this term "haters" used again recently it made me really question where that came from and if this mindset is affecting some from taking action in situations that obviously could benefit from a rider stepping up and saying something.
What if they got hurt? Again, my goal is to open up discussion about stuff like this.

This is the heart of the whole gig, in my opinion. It always has been, always will be - self-regulation is a bitch... it's your friends.
The thing is, if we are really all friends, we should be able to come to some agreements and stick to them. We should be able to avoid name calling (especially in public arenas) and we should be able to reach a compromise between having a shitload of fun, and being safe.
I still believe it can happen, but not without communication.

I think this year has been our best year in terms of people communicating at the spots. There is a lot of room for improvement, but I have seen so much worse and we seem to always be moving forward, which is a great sign.
I do think we should continue to be welcomed guests within F.D. and do our best in there, I don't want to say otherwise. My point was though about the curfew, I would expect that we will indeed see a few less kiters out there possibly in the future, and that as long as you leave before sun set, you won't be one of "the missing".

Last edited by Skyway Scott; 10-22-2007 at 11:12 AM.
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  #8  
Old 10-16-2007, 11:25 AM
popeye
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I hadn't really paid much attention until I saw it again when going over the video..

I think in this case the wind was pretty light which is why nobody seemed to concerned. It doesn't really matter to me who it was... it's not important. I only mentioned it to reinforce what Steve was saying .... that the sand bar is there and clear if you just walk (or jet ski) far up wind. Just wanted to encourage instructors to head out into the water... this is a water sport after all.
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  #9  
Old 10-16-2007, 11:32 AM
Skyway Scott
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I don't think who it was matters either, that's why I didn't even ask.
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  #10  
Old 10-16-2007, 02:04 PM
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Have a great day everyone!
Steve (813)389-3683 (always available to discuss safe kiting)

Last edited by kite-4-life; 10-17-2007 at 08:23 PM.
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