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  #1  
Old 02-01-2010, 06:38 AM
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Big G Big G is offline
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Default Who's leading the light wind category these days??

Well, its time to replace my light wind kite and I'd like to know who is leading this category these days. I've been very happy with My 14m Royal Era and would buy another however, I think the poor economy has made its mark on this sport also and I believe this company is out of buisiness.

Im considering an RRD Obsession but I was hoping to get some input on this topic....
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  #2  
Old 02-01-2010, 08:22 AM
CrazyJay CrazyJay is offline
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There is no question that the Flysurfer Speed III 15&19 meter kites are the light wind champions. They r pricey but if u want to be very powered in 10 knots they get the job done. They also jump huge!
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  #3  
Old 02-01-2010, 10:00 AM
kent kent is offline
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Actually, I really don't believe that the Speed is in the ball game if you look at it objectively. There are tons of dedicated riders that promote the benefits of ram air, however in looking at results of open course racing that measures effectiveness of a kite on all points of sail, no one considers to use any ram air.

I’d agree that in theory a ram air should simply be better, but it's clearly not the case. I even tested in very light wind a while back against the speed and we were worried that this thing would kill us, but it never came to happen.

Obviously, I’m bias due to my affiliation with Cabrinha, however factually speaking the Cabrinha 16 and 13 Crossbow IDS kites have won nearly every single light wind course race in the world (now racing to as little as 4-5 mph). Additionally, they have a significantly better wind range than nearly any other kite including other Cabrinha kites. The other detractor from ram air kites is their performance in gusty conditions. I actually got to see this first hand yesterday with the kite collapsing many times. It was however very gusty from 12-20 at the time.

If you are looking at any good light wind kite, make sure to make the proper line length adjustment. At a minimum you will want to go with 27-30 meters of line and maybe more depending on how light it is and the size board that you have.

In general it's pretty easy to get a ride in a crossbow. Give one a go if you can and see for your self when compared to other kites.
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  #4  
Old 02-01-2010, 11:25 AM
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Danimal8199 Danimal8199 is offline
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Kent,

I can't wait to hear some responses from the guys here in Tampa.

I personally don't have much of a desire to ride in 10-12kts but there are people here that swear by the foil kites and will argue with you about the range and the ability for them to handle gusts.

You do make a point about their performance in course racing. However, the guys here will probably say they never do course racing so they are happy with their performance.

Either way I think this will make for a good discussion.

Danny
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  #5  
Old 02-01-2010, 01:53 PM
kent kent is offline
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Good, bring it on! I actually prefer debating objective results for kites. Things like light wind performance are very easy to objectively test. Either you can plane and ride up wind in light air or you can't. I feel pretty good about my chances in this test. To be honest, the only way that you can actually test the truest light air performance would be to use on of my course boards as they will allow us to get into the lowest ranges of wind. In short, there is tons of money on the line for light wind racing all over the world. If they worked, someone would use them. Ram guys generally get pretty fanatical over these things for one reason or another. I'm just looking at results and my experiences. Maybe I'll take a ride on Dr. Light Winds kite next time I see him out and check it again.

One thing is for sure and not really open for debate... when it goes bad on a ram it goes really bad. I started on rams before 99.9% of the people on this forum ever rode. I had my fair share of swims and still continue to see some pretty long ones for ram users when it goes wrong. This really doesn't exclusively apply rams in very light wind as no good LEI will launch in the lightest stuff anyway. In truth as long as you get it up quickly, a ram is probably better in this area.

In any case, think what you like, but if you really want to know the truth check it out for yourself. I hope I'm wrong because I'm not above buying a ram to kick Damo's ass in light wind racing if it helps!
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  #6  
Old 02-01-2010, 07:21 PM
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Gator Gris Gator Gris is offline
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Default Crossbow vs. Switchblade

I have a quiver of 2008 Cabrihna Switchblade III's. I am bent at Cabrinha for not making any more 16M SB's.

I have demo'd the 2010 16M Crossbow and it falls backwards out of the wind window in light winds, while my switchblade stays right there. I am very worried about what I am going to buy to replace by SBIII when it is completely worn out.

Now that Cabrinha took away my favorite kite, I am keeping an eye out for a kite to beat my 2008 SBIII 16M. Still looking...
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  #7  
Old 02-01-2010, 08:53 PM
kent kent is offline
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Howdy Gator,

I hear ya, but i'd also offer a few suggestions on the CB. I have found that if you fly the kite in the center knot position on the back line that it is very easy to over sheet. You really have to run it on the last knot and run with some depower to avoid over sheeting. The kite is very, very good in the light stuff. I hope you can give it a go again. I'd also suggest running it with the pro bar upgrade kit and 5 meter line extensions to get the added push you are looking for.

I'll say that we tested the 11 CB against the 12 Sb and found that the bottom end was similar, but that the quick reaction to bar control on the CB was fantastic and gave the CB the edge over the SB. Unhookers will still really like the SB, but if you need the bottom end, i hope you try the CB one more time. as you may be aware, we do have a CB in a 16. this has tons of grunt and i'd put it up against even the older SB 16 for sure. Any demo 16 CB's in your area for you to try? i know it's tough to find one, but if not pls PM me so that we can see how to move forward.

PS. on the other hand we can also just wish for more wind!
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  #8  
Old 02-01-2010, 09:21 PM
robertovillate robertovillate is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big G View Post
Well, its time to replace my light wind kite and I'd like to know who is leading this category these days. I've been very happy with My 14m Royal Era and would buy another however, I think the poor economy has made its mark on this sport also and I believe this company is out of buisiness.

Im considering an RRD Obsession but I was hoping to get some input on this topic....
Just how light do you want to go?

The 14m Era was a great light wind kite - one of my favorites. You should really look at the 13.5 Kahoona (1.75 lbs lighter than the 2010 13m Waroo!) and some of the light wind 2010 Ozones for equal if not better performance than the Era. The RRD Obsession is an awesome kite, and they have the Religion coming out soon as well.

I believe that currently it's hard to beat a Flysurfer Silver Arrow if you are a heavier rider in under 12 kts. It's not a good kite for me because I am overpowered with it at around 14 kts. Also, you have to get used to the way the Flysurfer feels but you might be the only one riding some days when others are sitting on the beach wondering how the hell you can do it. A bit pricey too, pushing $3k usd.

I feel like once a kite gets much bigger than 15m it becomes heavy and innefficient (especially LEI's) - lots of drag and slow turning speed. Better to have the smallest kite possible and a good board. For $3k you could get a sweet LEI and a surfboard or race board.

But any kite needs "some" wind and if any kite goes down in under 5 kts it's nearly impossible to relaunch. As for self rescue I think LEI has an obvious advantage but I think it a bit of a non sequitur to say an LEI will perform as well in the super-uber-light wind speeds, from what I have seen.

Thankfully kites and boards have gotten a lot better the last few years. 13 is my big kite now. Hard to believe I used to fly a 20m Wipika! (wanna buy it? )

Let us know which direction you take and how your choice works out.
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  #9  
Old 02-01-2010, 10:16 PM
CrazyJay CrazyJay is offline
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I rode Mark's 15 meter Speed 3 in 23 knots the other day at east beach. Yes I was lit but not overpowered. This kite is a 21 meter inflatable and everyone else was riding 8's and 10's. To me that is amazing range and the safety release is amazing.
Granted it is not for beginners because the huge launch and 100 meter flight r extreme but in 11 yrs of kiting I have yet to ride a kite with that much power, depower, lift, and float.
Btw.. The Speed 3 is a closed cell foil, not a ram air, and it relaunched super easy.
I'm not a flysurfer rep and am not pushing their gear but damn.... I was impressed.
Unfortunately they r expensive, but worth every penny If ya wanna b lit in 10 knots
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  #10  
Old 02-02-2010, 07:13 AM
kent kent is offline
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Jay,

Good points, but if you think being lit in 10 knots is still light, you really need to try some new light wind boards. Any decent LEI or RAM will do this. I guess that in the end, maybe there is no difference because the board is really the largest factor.

My point still remains that I'd sure like to see any Ram air tested on different points of sail against a good LEI to see the facts. That's upwind, reaching, and down wind as all are important in fun factor. That's getting home, going fast, and ripping down wind. As a point of fact, i don't even use the 16 as my 13 is fine down to 6-7 on the boards i generally use.
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