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  #11  
Old 03-15-2010, 05:38 PM
greg meintjes greg meintjes is offline
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Location: St Augustine, Fl
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Default individual bans

We have been fighting this sort of behaviour for years and nothing seems to stop it. It would be great if there was some way to get individuals who are reckless and a danger to the sport and the general public banned and not have the whole beach banned from kiting. Maybe if the locals at the trouble spots form a group / association and approach their respective town committees and get some sort of authority to call the law enforcement agencies who would then evict the rider from the location.

One problem with this would be to ensure that if there is a kite company that operates at a location, they do not abuse this system to shut out competitive brands and riders or that riders do not make personal attacks and try get someone band because they do not like them etc , one way to help avoid this would be the formation of an association or club for example "Hobie Kite Club"

As we get more kiters on the water we are going to get more new hotshots that want to be the big man on the water, and as much as we would love to just go kite and not worry about these problems, they are here and we need to put more effort in to preserve access.

Greg
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  #12  
Old 03-15-2010, 06:43 PM
conchxpress conchxpress is offline
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Location: South Tampa, Key West
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Agree with all you guys. However, you're forgetting one thing. Nobody can see Mr. Beach Hero up close out on the sandbar. He doesn't really care if he can do the trick, only if the "amazed bystanders" can see him to the trick. It's called low self esteem desperately seeking the admiration of others. You saw this in first grade with the emerging class clown. Going to be hard to cure 20+ years of behavior with a stern talking to. But peer pressure is the only way to go. Post a picture of him on the beach labeled "unsafe kiter please avoid". He'll get the picture. No pun intended.
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  #13  
Old 03-15-2010, 09:12 PM
Whitey Whitey is offline
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It's pure and simple "Look at me". Locals need to let him know they saw him and tell him and they are not impressed. Ask him to "STOP" nice the first time. Don't assume that he takes the time to read this forum. Hate to see you guys loose a spot down south, as there are so few left to ride at. Posting video is the first step to letting these starved ego's know that it is not cool, is not acceptable, and will not be tolerated, as much as surfing has become ugly in places we need to take a page from there book in these cases. It has to be taken up face to face, really close face to face. This is like watching a kid play with a loaded gun, and your access is in the room with him. Just one persons opinion.
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  #14  
Old 03-16-2010, 09:43 AM
BizGuru BizGuru is offline
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Why is everyone saying it is not a local problem? I have seen plenty of locals inside the swim buoy. I understand that this guy throwing kiteloops over people's heads is taking it to the next levels, but I am sure there were plenty of locals riding inside the buoys, just in a slightly less dangerous manor. Also it is a local problem cause if the "non Miami natives" show up and shut it down with stupid actions, you lose the spot as well. I love to travel around Florida to kite, and one thing that is very clear is the Miami seen has more of a "Not my problem" attitude than ANY other local crew I have had the pleasure to ride with. Not saying everyone is bad, just in Tampa, St Augustine, Jacksonville, Jupiter, and even Pompano, when one person walks up to talk with a kiter, there is a pile of people behind him to enforce the severity of the issue. Most of what I see in Miami is one guy talks to a problem kiter and gets ignored. In many areas this beach enforcement is driven by the local shops and school, with support of the locals. Considering the ratio of closed to open beaches for kiting in Miami compared to other areas, I think I look at how it is handled elsewhere may not be a bad idea. I will say Matheson has got much better over the past few years. But still nothing like what you see up north. I don't want this to come off as a negative post, just trying to push some general observations. This is NOT an attack on Miami or the kite community there, just some constructive criticism. Also I would like to thank the person for posting the video, really points out the problem and gets people motivated and discussing the issues, even if the idiot (not gonna avoid a personal attack when someone is being that stupid) in it never sees it.

Who was giving lessons at Hobie?
I thought it was an accepted fact that Hobie was not suitable for teaching?
This is what should be documented and sent to the appropriate certifying organization. I have avoided Hobie for the obvious reasons plus the Keys and West Coast are so much better on a west wind. However, next time I am there I will make sure to bring a camera and document the teaching. Cause that is just plan stupid. The shops and school should be leading by example... which has not always been the case in Miami.
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  #15  
Old 03-16-2010, 10:53 AM
kent kent is offline
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Ken,

Yep, there were locals in there too. The teaching thing is well documented and I'm sure that a simple search would pull up most of the info on this forum. It's generally the same crew and I doubt that many, if any are certified. You do have a good point though. Get some pics and send them into IKO and PASA. If this is against their professional guidelines they should know. Additionally, the poor person paying for the lesson wouldn't really know the danger that they are in.

Two of the guys teaching were on Best kites. One of them is surely not on the "A" list from Best and I'm sure that they have nothing to do with him, I don't know about the other, just that he teaches on a red Best. There are a ton of these "dealers" and "schools" around that operate on the fringes.

I guess it's good to give props to those that do not teach at Hobie.

Miami Kiteboarding
Wind Addict
etc. i know that there are tons more, just not sure what the school names are.
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  #16  
Old 03-16-2010, 06:27 PM
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RickI RickI is offline
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Heard some more about what went on that day. It was estimated that there were 70 kites on the water at one point. Winds were extremely gusty, typical for land shadowed winds out of westerly directions. Lots of guys were riding inside the buoys. There were lots of newbies trying to figure out how to kite in what amounted to pretty dangerous wind conditions close to shore. There were people giving lessons inside the buoys adding to the situation. It was a dense, crowed condition. Understand a foil stalled as they will do at times and wrapped another guy's lines. Another kiter went out in what amounts to a four line 20 m C kite!? Got overpowered and sent the kite shoreward. And on and on ...

For starters, we need to launch and land out near the buoys, ride out beyond them and NOT have a kite up near the beach. This alone would improve things a great deal.

There are other problems but this would be a great start getting things sorted out.
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Last edited by RickI; 03-16-2010 at 06:46 PM.
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  #17  
Old 03-16-2010, 07:24 PM
Stein Stein is offline
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Posts: 3
Default Hobie beach instructors

Hi Rick,

Here is a list of PASA Instructors who are legal in Florida. There are many people who have completed the course, but are not current or insured. If you have people teaching on your beach and they claim to be PASA check the web site. If they are not on it they are operating without insurance and you can have them booted from the beach.
Notice that there are NO listings for instructors in Miami. If you are teaching in Miami and are current and insured, call Chris Moore at PASA and have this list updated.

Stein Erik Gabrielsen
PASA Examiner

Laurel Kaiser Island Style Wind & Watersports
Sarasota
FL
USA
34234

Greg Meintjes Key West Kiteboarding
Key WEST
Fl
USA
33040

Steve Sipes Kiss The Sky Kiteboarding
Bradenton
FL
USA
34208
Jeremy Lund New Wave Kiteboarding
palm beach
fl
usa
33403
Kevin Wade
Key Largo
FL

33037
Brian Goldesberry Independent
Daytona /New Smyrna
FL
USA
32763
Mike Olness oTHErside boardsports
marathon
fl
usa
33050
Richard Peck Kiteboarding Sarasota
Sarasota
FL
USA
34229
Aaron Osters Marathon Florida Keys Kiteboarding LLC
Marathon
Florida
USA

Last edited by RickI; 03-18-2010 at 01:53 PM.
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  #18  
Old 03-16-2010, 09:21 PM
troubleshooter troubleshooter is offline
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I think the reason Hobie is what it is is that it is hopeless. It has gotten so out of control it is like the Mad Max movies. No body gives a shit anymore about that spot. I dont support what goes on there but it is very obvious what it has become.

I personally hope it goes away. Not a good spot for anyone...beginner or advanced. I would hope we voluntarily make it go away. It is dangerous there. Teaching is openly advertised there.

And by the way. I disagree with you Bizguru. Hobie is THE exception. It is lost and we will lose because of it. However, Crandon crew, Matheson crew, keys crew...top notch. And yes i do take it as a bit negative since this is my home turf.

Just so you know, you cant compare other beaches in Florida to Miami. It is so tightly regulated here because beaches=money=tourists...more so than anywhere. 60% (im guessing) of our bayshore is protected mangroves. Miami is a very difficult access spot. We have lost a few beaches but there are many other reasons behind. If your not local, PM me anytime and we can ride. I love to ride all over the Keys as well and Im not limited to beach launches.
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  #19  
Old 03-16-2010, 10:51 PM
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RickI RickI is offline
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PASA left Greg Meintjes off the list, slow accounting to be sure. Just put him in.


Wow, that is a short list. Thanks for posting it Stein, had no idea how many instructors have been certified but don't have insurance. There are a lot that aren't current and uninsured.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stein View Post
Hi Rick,

Here is a list of PASA Instructors who are legal in Florida. There are many people who have completed the course, but are not current or insured. If you have people teaching on your beach and they claim to be PASA check the web site. If they are not on it they are operating without insurance and you can have them booted from the beach.
Notice that there are NO listings for instructors in Miami. If you are teaching in Miami and are current and insured, call Chris Moore at PASA and have this list updated.

Stein Erik Gabrielsen
PASA Examiner

Laurel Kaiser Island Style Wind & Watersports
Sarasota
FL
USA
34234

Greg Meintjes Key West Kiteboarding
Key WEST
Fl
USA
33040


Steve Sipes Kiss The Sky Kiteboarding
Bradenton
FL
USA
34208
Jeremy Lund New Wave Kiteboarding
palm beach
fl
usa
33403
Kevin Wade
Key Largo
FL

33037
Brian Goldesberry Independent
Daytona /New Smyrna
FL
USA
32763
Mike Olness oTHErside boardsports
marathon
fl
usa
33050
Richard Peck Kiteboarding Sarasota
Sarasota
FL
USA
34229
Aaron Osters Marathon Florida Keys Kiteboarding LLC
Marathon
Florida
USA
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Last edited by RickI; 03-18-2010 at 01:52 PM.
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  #20  
Old 03-16-2010, 11:01 PM
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RickI RickI is offline
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Kent talked years ago about a voluntary ban at Hobie for the reasons you cite. It made sense then, still does particularly with the wild west indifference that has been so characteristic of the place almost since the start.

I tried to promote sea taxi runs out to Biscayne Bay for the last several years. There are so few easily accessible public launches in Miami. It just hasn't taken off for a variety of reasons. Too bad as the shore side list is still shrinking. When conditions are good out there, they're great and right in Miami. People just don't get it, maybe someday they will.
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