Accidents at Hobie Beach (12-15-07)
 

I heard about an accident and unrelated incident that happened at Hobie Beach in Miami yesterday. One of the guys was taken away in a ambulance while the other easily could have been or worse but wasn't. Can anyone provide more details either here or via PM to ricki?

I showed up just after the ambulance I guess. I don't know much about that one, but I understand that it might not be too bad. I hope we hear soon. I did see that second one though. The guy from Pompano was riding very close to the beach and got pulled into a trash can. his kite was looping just over the bike path. This guy was very lucky, but didn't even seem to know that he just got a get out of jail free card.

I didn't end up riding, but i can say that no one but Garry and his girl were riding in the right spot. The rules as laid out 2 years ago are simply that you must launch your kite well offshore and all riding must be done outside of the swim buoys. There were mainly riders from Pompano and Lauderdale and even some schools. Even the instructors were riding way too close. At least it is nice to see that Miami isn't the only home to schools that are risking their futures by dangerous riding that will likly result in banned beaches.

I guess that the only thing that may save us is if all of us take charge of our beaches. If you see something wrong, let the rider know. It isn't just up to Tim or others. If you like riding at a particular location and want to keep doing it, stand up and let people know the rules. Launching or waking with a kite in the parking lot probably deserves a good ass kicking, but to start, firmly ask the offender not to do it. If they do it again, recommend that they ride elsewhere. This continually happens at Matheson. If you buddy is riding inside the marks, let them know. We all need to be a part of protecting our beaches. In most cases the offender probably didn't know the rules and would appreciate the advise.

It's going to be a windy start to this week. Let's make sure that we all have beaches to ride at next week! See you on the water.

Kent

Do the people who are teaching have no conscience that are putting someone in harms way? Teaching at hobbie?

Man maybe i am getting to upset at this anymore, but i can see if you teach some one bad habits and they think is a safe area, then they go anywhere and do the same thing. Cant really blame the rider, if they learned on shore with riders around and could hit the parking lot. Sounds like a survival course, more than kiteboarding.....i dont know, does anyone else feel this way or am i just a raging kook.....ok, well back out to the water.

Thanks for the information Kent. I wonder how many folks have been injured at Hobie or came perilously close to it over the years by:

1. Flying or riding with a kite too close to shore and inside the swim buoys.

2. Underestimating the gusty and frequently squally winds that come with SW conditions.

Add to that no practice hitting quick releases, functional kite leashes and the list goes up even more.


We really do need to step up and as tactfully and effectively as we can try to preserve our access. Take a few guys over and talk with the kiter creating issues. If one of these idiots gets lofted or dragged hits you, a loved one or your car, you may find reason to intercede, too late.

I had a leaping gnome get lofted off the water and blown into a car 15 ft. away from me, closer still to my now wife and do about a $1000. damage to a parked car. He didn't get a scratch out of it. This was probably six years ago, I think Kent and Neil were there as well and may have their own recollections. What has changed, awareness, even among some instructors? Doesn't seem to be the case, get a clue before the opportunity to get thrown on the barbeque comes along.

I feel the same way, Paul. I actually appreciate hearing guys like you, Ken and others stating these ideas on the forums for others to read.
The message needs to get out there to not put up with obvious kooky behavior and stand up for your spots. The more riders that agree to this, the easier it is to have agreement among the riders and carry out a "plan of attack" on kooky behaviors.
Sometimes things aren't black and white, and I am not going to claim to understand how to deal with those situations.
But when it is obviously a kook move, I think the behavior should be stopped. Gray areas are fuzzy. Obvious kooky behavior shouldn't be tolerated, imo. Land jumping just upwind of power lines sounds pretty kooky. Launching in parking lots sounds pretty kooky.

You are not raging-out, Paul. I would love to see you, Kent, Rick and others be even more vocal about steps we can all take and agree to on this forum to insure we have all of our spots for a long time.

It's not about stopping the fun or killing the stoke, imo.
It's actually about insuring we can have fun and get stoked for a long time to come.

BTW, it hasn't been too common to see really kooky stuff here lately, but when we do, it needs to be stopped, not watched.

Did anyone ever find out who got hurt at Hobie? Are they ok?

Kent

[QUOTE=Skyway Scott;26534]

It's not about stopping the fun or killing the stoke, imo.
QUOTE]

ive seen you type "imo" for the last few months and i still dont get what its supposed to mean, can you help me out? Thanks:confused:

In my opinion.
It basically means I realize many feel otherwise or just don't care about the topic.
Did you ride your "home spot" this past Saturday?
If so, was it gusty? I was thinking about riding there, but thought it might be too far south.

Here's what I know..
 

I was riding Sunday morning until the storm clouds rolled in. After landing the kite, I decided to pack up before the rain, since I didn't have a lot of time left, anyway. At some point, I heard thunder. When I drove out, there were still way too many kites out there, but people were finally starting to come in.

Anyway, 10 minutes later, my friend called to tell me what happened. The guy was near shore with his kite at 12 o'clock. I don't know if he was going out or coming in, but it must have been at least 20 minutes after the time I heard the thunder. The first wind gust knocked his kite out of the sky, and the second gust pulled him head first into the grill of a car.

I don't have any updates.

Thanks for posting the information. This same thing has played out a number of times before at Hobie. Would there be any chance that I could speak directly with your friend? There are some more details that would help, i.e. wind range, direction, sky conditions, type and size of kite, distance traveled, etc.) If this works would you please PM his number to ricki? Thanks!

ya i had to work on sat night so i missed out. but i was soo determined to kite, sun i woke up early and took a city bus to the beach with my gear, and found that it was way to windy for my 16 so i just watched. but im really bummed that i couldnt kite becaues of too much wind.

Yeah, almost worse than no wind. Good call though.
Smart, smart, smart.

Well put, Paul. Students will do exactly what they are taught at the places they are taught. (Monkey see, monkey do) It is a fact and been an issue everywhere for years. Site evaluation, gear selection, weather conditions, safety systems/ procedures, should all be understood by the student PRIOR to flying a kite, and demonstrated/practiced by the student throughout their lesson. The true reward of being an instructor is not how much money you made that day or if you sold them some gear. It is watching them progress into a safe, independent kiteboarder and ride away from the beach with confidence, knowledge, and respect for Mother Nature/ fellow kiters.
I let every one of my students know about this site and encourage them to read every bit of it. We are lucky to have guys like Rick looking out for us and spreading the word about safe kiting.
Thanks Paul, Rick and all the others who promote safe kiting!
Merry Christmas to everyone!

Hobie accident
 

I was at Hobie that day, in fact it was my vehicle he hit. There was a frontal line coming in, most riders including myself came in. I had put away my gear for the day and was in my truck when a rider was having a hard time with the gusty wind. Several people were yelling at him to let it go, 1st he was lofted out of the water to the beach line and then from there into the front of my truck (grill and bumper). I actually thought he was coming thru the winshield. I immediately called 911 and rendered first aid, he was able to talk and had a bit of trouble breathing, definately got the shit knocked out of him but not apparent serious injuries. There was an instructor right next to the whole incident, he was yelling at the guy the whole time ( about 20 seconds), the rider did have enough time to react to all the verbal instructions .
Hopefully he is well.
Hobie is not a place for those that are new to the sport......BEWARE !!!!!!!!!!IT IS DANGEROUS!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Modart,

Do you know if the "instructor" was teaching at the time? I think that we as kiters that enjoy this sport need to be very diligent as to protecting our beaches. Teaching off of a beach at Crandon or Matheson, while not great is not in the same ball park as teaching at Hobie Beach. We simply can not allow anyone to teach at Hobie Beach EVER. I would strongly encourage those that see anyone teaching at Hobie to kindly ask them to refrain from doing so. This would include our local group of instructors and friends teaching friends. This place is for very, very experienced riders that also have common sense.

Kent

Seriously time to start taking this instuctor teaching in bad places and illegaly for real. This just blows me away, and people will only bitch after something is banned or someone is hurt bad or worse. Time to get some balls people this shit is getting bad.
Some one who doesnt know anything is only as good as the person helping them. So lets not blame the guy taking the lesson.

We have had a similar problem like this in Tampa Bay for quite a while. The instructor is well liked (even by me) but his (or hers) choice of teaching location is misleading to the student, and all attempts at finding a solution have had no results. It seems that some are more concerned with selling a 2 hour lesson and a kite package than the preservation of EVERYONE'S access at this launch. If a local instructor will do it, so will traveling instructors/students/newbies/cowboys/kooks/etc.- leading to an increased risk of accident or loss of access.
-AS AN INSTRUCTOR, IT IS YOUR RESPONSIBILITY TO LEAD BY EXAMPLE.

The instructor I referred to was not local and was not giving lessons at the time. I know this after having talked with him when first arriving, in fact he was visiting from out of the country. He was in close proximity as the events un-folded.
Recently where I ride (14th st) an individual about took my head off wih his lines, experienced rider just not paying attention to wth he was doing, needless to say he had a few discussions regarding this. Haven't seen him around since.
Protecting your riding area is important!!!!!!

It looks like conditions will be ripe for accidents at Hobie Beach over the next couple of days. Strong winds are forecast 15 to 25 mph Friday (are already blowing 15 to 30 mph as of Friday am*) and particularly for Saturday, 20 to 30 mph and likely much higher in squalls. There is a 60% rain chance for Saturday alone with a strong cold front passing over.

NO INSTRUCTORS should be teaching there and sensible kiters should avoid the area. I understand a student was injured recently in a squall in the area and was well offshore.

NO KITEBOARDERS should be launching or riding much inside the swim buoys. Guys jumping nearshore are not only breaking the law they are begging to eat someone's bumper or shattered windshield, AGAIN.


** NEWS FLASH **
Just because you are flying a flat kite doesn't mean you are automatically safe from squalls. If that is all you have ever flown you may not believe that as much as someone who came from C kites. Dealing with squall gusts can be complex, your reactions and systems can fail, many things can and have gone wrong.


How many kiters have been lofted into cars and timber posts at this beach over the years? I can think of at least five but there likely has been more. I can still remember chilling stories of the lady kiteboarder from California who was lofted into a timber post screaming in agony with kidney damage and fractures in a similar SW wind 6 years ago last month. Kiteboarding Magazine tastefully included a photo of the injured woman on their back page at the time. That was years ago and too many people haven't gotten the idea yet. For that reason alone two shocking images are reproduced below. I apologize to the rider, her friends and kiters that were there that day for showing these here.

http://www.kitezone.ca/simages/kitecrash_1.gif http://www.kitezone.ca/simages/kitecrash_2.gif
From: http://www.kiteforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=2296336

I remember a guy getting ripped off the water and blown into a car flying 15 ft. away from me in less than a 32 mph gust. If any one of them struck head first they could have easily been taken out.


Why is Hobie dangerous?

- Southwest to west winds are gusty due to land shadow from the western shore a short distance away.

- Southwest to west winds come with fronts and powerful squall lines frequently with dangerous gusty winds.

- There is virtually NO beach or reasonable safety buffer onshore. The timber posts and parked cars are feet away.

- There is a four lane high speed roadway, Rickenbacker Causeway, a short distance away.

- Riders have foolishly launched and landed on or near the shore and ridden too close to shore out of bounds swim areas marked by buoys for too many years.

- Too many easily avoidable accidents have happened here. We need to improve this situation, now. Don't ride there in these conditions.

http://www.fksa.org/albums/album243/...obie_Beach.jpg

http://www.fksa.org/albums/album243/Hobie.jpg
Illustrations of past loftings

http://www.fksa.org/albums/album344/newgraph.gif
The winds at Hobie Friday morning (3.7.08), WITHOUT squalls and a 5 to 10 ft. buffer from timber poles, cars and more. The guy that was lofted into a car in front of me was out in winds little stronger than this.

Unfortunately , the guys who take the liberty to teach in hobie beach , will do it anywhere and anytime, because at that point there are not led by conscious or responsible thoughts but simply by ca$h.
And in this state of mind, the concepts of riders community" safety", Liabilities risks " or just guiltiness" doesn't not even cross their mind ....

I'm still chocked when i see "self-made instructors" or even worst: certified ones(?) throwing their students into Bodydragging exercises with kids and bystanders right in their wind window , 30 yards from the beach in 1 feet of water , on a hot sunday ! as it can be in Hobie.

Being an instructor and trainer , that;s details we observe rigth away on a spot> where the danger can come from ? and it's sad to say in this case, it comes from guys supposed to set an example and teach the opposite.

So it can not work , cause you can be sure the same student will come back and practice in the same spot by himself , in the same conditions as soon as they get sold a kite...! likely be the same instrcutors ...and so on.

Basically, u must know that for a couple of hundred $$, some guys have no more respect than this regarding the fragile beach accesses we have for our sport.

What everybody should know mostly is that Hobie is a spot tolerated by "default " since there is no signs to forbid kitesurfing yet, but there were working on it 3 years ago, apparently they stopped the process , not for long i think.

But more than anything, as we warned before: if there is a kite involved in a car accident or just injured bystander at Hobie, we can expect the big Media cover and the definitive ban with a sign up right after , maybe extended to other beaches , depends how bad will be the incident . …

still we see the same behavior from every day’s can’t-happen-to-me riders .


The funny thing is we still have some cheap “hotshots riders” out there who are still thrilled by throwing the same-old-move-they-know to impress 2 fat chicks wrecked on their beach towels meanwhile he lands in between 2 other kids playing 10 feet away from the beach …yet the dude smile and already prepare mentally the next move he could boost…unhooked , maybe ??

So As Rick Iossi perfectly described about Hobie as a riding spot and to confirm Paul, Kent's, all of those riding here for long enough:

Riding on hobie is typically before a front ( warm or cold) when the wind veers to the S first, then SSW as the front lines passes over associated with squalls from heavy Rain and or Cummulonimbus, T-storms, etc,
So keep an eye and be ready to get back to shore BEFORE THE GUST FRONT HITS .

Next step, you still have to make your way through, rocks, trees , cars, pickup trucks, broken glasses, Cops, kids, dogs, bikes, joggers …then:

YES you can ride at Hobie, but must walk, launch & waterstart 50 yards ( 2 lengths of lines) from the shoreline. And stay out of the buoys at all time.

NO You can’t teach at Hobie , it’s cheap, dangerous ,disrespectful for the riders and bystanders and your students…and from the beginning, illegal.

After it’s up to each of us to apply these simples rules, which should not be a problem for whoever pretend caring for the kitesurfing community where we all ride.
If we all do and say it , only the bad ones should stand out. ?

Well put MKB. The real issue is that when consumers sign up for lessons they put their trust in an instructor. How are they supposed to know that these guys don't know what they are doing?

Want to Win a Prize?

I've got a FREE NPX Hydrotex for the best photo of one of "South Florida's best" teaching at Hobie today or tomorrow. It has to be a lesson and clearly show the "instructor" teaching at this location. Good video will earn you a lycra as well.

Also...

If we get good footage of an industry member ie. instructor, team rider, representative in the air less than 1 kite lines length away from the beach Adventure Sports Miami will anti up again! YUP, add a prize. That's another NPX Hydrotex! Same as above, if you can immortalize the rider in video you've got yourself a lycra too!

It's only for the best in each of the 2 categories above. So there will be 2 winners if we get submissions in each category. Submissions will be judged by Garry "the body Menk and "Two Tall" Todd Greaux. We will take submissions at info@adventuresportsmiami.com. Any submission that appears to have been staged or encouraged will result in disqualification. Please DO NOT include the names of the riders in photos or video as our crack judging staff is familiar with all industry members in S. Florida.

If you see anyone teaching at Hobie, I'd suggest informing the student of the dangerous situation that they are in and they should seek more qualified instruction. This is of course after you secure your prize winning photo or video.

In truth we shouldn't really even be riding at Hobie as we have proven that we can't control ourselves. Therefore, if we do choose to ride there we need to police the beach carefully. Let's all get serious to protect our riding locations and keep them open. Shoot away!!!

Kent

Good summary and to the point Christophe. Kent, that is an inspired idea! I hope there are no takers, but if there has to be, hope they get some good clear images. We need to stop abuses, especially the easily avoided ones at our launches soon.

Thanks for all the input!

Tomorrow is another day, one with the arrival of a strong cold front with a nasty looking band of squalls. Squalls and unstable gusty winds are likely to occur in the area tomorrow. History repeats itself? Maybe, the choice is yours.

http://www.wunderground.com/data/640x480/2xse_ir.gif

http://images.intellicast.com/WeatherImg/Radar/pie.gif

You can see realtime winds during the passage of the front at:
http://windmapper.com/?Loc=FL
and
http://www.ikitesurf.com/windandwhere.iws?regionID=171

Checkout: http://www.wunderground.com/stationm...0.20020&zoom=6



.

Here's the latest out of NWS for the area:

THIS AFTERNOON
SOUTHWEST WINDS 20 TO 25 KNOTS BECOMING NORTHWEST
IN THE AFTERNOON. GUSTS UP TO GALE FORCE. NEAR SHORE...SEAS 3 TO 5
FEET. IN THE GULF STREAM...SEAS 6 TO 8 FEET BUILDING TO 8 TO 10
FEET IN THE AFTERNOON. INTRACOASTAL WATERS CHOPPY. SLIGHT CHANCE OF
SHOWERS IN THE MORNING.

Gale force = around 40 mph.

I think Kent was right, things are spot on for some serious problems today at Hobie.

any problems? or did that do the trick?

and wasn't that the warmest NW we've ever had???

As it turned out, the wind went NW a bit earlier than expected. Therefore, I don't think that we got too many submissions from Hobie. I did receive a few requests asking that Crandon be included as well. One potential winner failed to have his camera ready when he saw an "instructor" flying his kite well above his head in gusty conditions at the sign in desk while talking to a prospective client! That's the way to encourage respect for power of the kite.

So in the spirit of good clean fun and prizes for all, we will also have an "open" category that will accept photos from any Florida riding location. The rules are earlier in the post. We will judge submissions from the 3 divisions on April 1st as this is appropriately "Fools Day". Happy hunting!

PS. send all submissions to info@adventuresportsmiami.com

Kent

Way to go Kent, a STATE WIDE contest! I think you may be on to something that could bring some good and necessary awareness out there.

Get those cameras warmed up. You may be doing more than shooting some candid images and winning a rash guard. Your actions may be saving us some serious grief down the road.

Kent asked that I bring this back up to the top. I agree, we need to tighten things up in instruction. Instructors are the experts, establish the standard of care for their students perhaps for their entire kiting career. That is a big obligation and one to be taken very seriously. Instructors need to protect their students from high risk practices certainly during the course to a reasonable degree and equipment them with the knowledge and guidelines to watch out for themselves once they leave instruction.

This is obvious, there is nothing remarkable or controversial about it. Instruction in many other actions sports has paralleled this for a long time. We need to step up what we are doing in instruction to preserve our access, the odd student and others.