Some plan to purposely get kiteboarding banned in FLL
 

So this is the deal and what I have found out.

There is a small group of younger kiteboarders in our area that have a plan. Their plan is to purposely get kiteboarding banned on all Ft. Lauderdale beaches!!! Their reasoning behind this is, that if kiting is banned know one will be legally allowed to kite in Ft. Lauderdale and that will keep everyone away but them. They feel they can dodge the authorities by launching in other areas and outrun the police.
This is a direct copy and paste email I received yesterday when investigating this serious problem:

"It was probably one of my buds around here. That my good friend in the pic though. Honestly XXXX, you are not going to get any good response from the kids here in Fort Lauderdale. The more beaches here that get "shut down" , the less the rules become. Everyone here sees it as this. If FTL beach is a no kite zone, then no one is on there toes ready to **** with kiters.... So for us/them kids, it's not really a problem. They will always be nice slicks infront of private hotels, down near our port, and other little secret spots."

"FTL kids see a ban to be a way to get the "kooks" away. Off the top of my head, riding here for the past 6 years, I can think of one kid that spoke up to his friends about "breaking the rules kiting" and that is because his dad kites. He knew that if it would be banned his dad wouldn't ride here anymore. As well as kids go, I dont think a ban will every stop them. I remember going through phases where kids would do downwinders just to get the ATVS to start chasing them, and watch them haul ass until the end of there jurisdiction. This kept happening over and over until finally a cop boat came out and slammed some kids.
Next cold front, everyone was back out."

On Sunday last, when Tiki Beach was temporarily closed down due to riders in the swim area, a group of kiters started just south of the inlet and rode all the way to Lauderdale Bye The Sea purposely through all the swim areas and in front of every life guard in their selfish quest to get our beaches banned.

When arriving in LBS they were confronted by another kiter who had words with them, their response was screw you, f-off and things like I am going away for a couple of years so I don't care, I will do whatever I want and have fun!

I am amazed that it has come to this and can't believe I am actually writing this. I need your support, these are all of our beaches my lively hood, Jesse from Liquids lively hood and it is time to come together and stop these few before the achieve their selfish goals.
Thanks for your support.....

Neil Hutchinson
Slingshot Sports
954-647-7228

Call the cops and the coast guard, and pass on the info and the email.

Boats will be on their toes waiting for these guys to come by... a few $500 fines and the game is over.

This will make it clear to the officials that it is a FEW problem guys who need to be dealt with on an individual basis.

Normally I would not suggest to go this route but what these guys are doing is extremely destructive to kiteboarding everywhere.

For about four or so guys to do this with the reported intent of getting kiting shut down in Ft. Lauderdale is incredibly maligned and stupid. When these guys grow up in a few years, they probably wouldn't even remember why they wanted to do it. That is assuming they still even kite then. One ban could easily follow another, it isn't a tap you can turn on and off. Short sighted, flawed judgement. Add to that messing with all the lifeguards along three miles Ft. Lauderdale beach after launching from way to the south off private beaches. That is intentionally messing with and distracting about 20 lifeguards from their duty trying to look out for swimmers on a real busy day with waves, rip currents possibly. Rubin is so proud of it he puts his photo, several feet off the beach on his facebook page?! Real bad and not representative of 99 % of the kiters I know.

This is poor, destructive behavior for all of us to have to deal with and so needlessly. Is it ok if these very few guys try to shut down your kiting privileges? I bet they might try to do the same thing again if this is left up in the air.

This is just bad for all of us

I dont know where you got your information from, but if you are going to quote someone, you need to tell the truth.
These guys may have screwed up by going inside the buoys, but do you know how ignorant it sounds when you say they are intentionally trying to get the beach banned????
THAT COULDNT BE ANY FARTHER FROM THE TRUTH. Maybe the older guys could have been a little kinder in the way they handled the younger guys.
For you to stoop so low as to post minors pictures on the web and put words in their mouths is pretty poor judgement!!
You should be setting examples for the younger ones, maybe explaining to them why being inside the buoys is destructive to the sport instead of cursing at them like drunkin sailors! If you would have respected them and talked to them the right way, they would have respected you back. We were all young once also...

These riders are advanced riders and they 100% know the rules. They were confronted at LBS and the person who talked to them was rudely blown off with multiple cussining. The quote actually came from one of thier friends.
I and many others have worked extremely hard for over 10 years now to keep FLL open to kiting, and we are still working hard on it. I am not going to let a few people ruin it for everyone, especially when they know better.
These guys blatently rode the entire length of FLL beach with life guards blowing thier whistles, not even attempting to ride outside and just back and forth in the swim area. This was Sunday afternoon 80 degreeze and spring break. Witnessed by other local kiters and reported to personally to me by the head FLL lifeguard who is also a begginer kiter.

Hey hey
 

Like already said to Rick, the initial post on the site wasn't from me. I don't think anyone is "for the ban". This little telephone game everyone is playing has changed from "the kids around here don't care" to "The kids are on a quest to get kiteboarding banned, and for that reason they kite inside the bouys"

IT seems like you are blowing this a little out of proportion. Im sure they are not looking to "BAN KITING IN FTL.....". They like to kite just as much as anyone else. Cheer up sport

Quotes, how do you take this? I also remember hearing, first hand one persons take on LBS a year ago and what they hope would happen.

"It was probably one of my buds around here. That my good friend in the pic though. Honestly XXXX, you are not going to get any good response from the kids here in Fort Lauderdale. The more beaches here that get "shut down" , the less the rules become. Everyone here sees it as this. If FTL beach is a no kite zone, then no one is on there toes ready to **** with kiters.... So for us/them kids, it's not really a problem. They will always be nice slicks infront of private hotels, down near our port, and other little secret spots."

"FTL kids see a ban to be a way to get the "kooks" away. Off the top of my head, riding here for the past 6 years, I can think of one kid that spoke up to his friends about "breaking the rules kiting" and that is because his dad kites. He knew that if it would be banned his dad wouldn't ride here anymore. As well as kids go, I dont think a ban will every stop them. I remember going through phases where kids would do downwinders just to get the ATVS to start chasing them, and watch them haul ass until the end of there jurisdiction. This kept happening over and over until finally a cop boat came out and slammed some kids.
Next cold front, everyone was back out."

Its interesting that this users account as well as "Kiteboard101101" was only created today.... and these are the only ever posts. I wonder who they are??? Maybe they are the guys in question and can not speak up for themselves????

Its funny you say that because i dont even kite so dont come pointing fingers... not gonna lie those guys shred though. I created an account because i saw this thread and recognized some of the mentioned. I just thought it add my thoughts on it.... ha Nice try tho sherlock.

All these guys are experienced local riders, some have been at it for years. They know the rules, ANYONE who spends anytime around Ft. Lauderdale Beach knows you stay outside the buoys. I learned that in no uncertain terms decades back growing up there, nothing has changed in that regard either.

How long did it take for these guys, riding back and forth to cover the entire Ft. Lauderdale Public Beach, thirty minutes, more? In the photos, they were approaching within 50 ft. of the beach, the buoys are about 400 ft. offshore! Lifeguards were in fits, perhaps 20 of them at several hundred foot intervals, trying to get these guys out of the swim area. If a guard is repeatedly blowing his whistle, running down by the water and you are 800 ft. offshore, you can't miss it. At 50 to 200 ft., it is right in your face and something you can't ignore, unless you choose to.

What is the greatest problem we've had at Ft. Lauderdale, for almost TEN YEARS, guys riding inside the buoys in the swim zone. Thanks to a lot of hard work, it has become more rare. This is common knowledge and why lots of us spent a great deal of time in Commission meetings for years trying to preserve access here. Multiply that by a few hundred times, and that is what Neil has invested in trying to keep the sport alive here. No way, this should be trashed for the misguided efforts of a very few riders.

There you go Sherlock, your shredders are ruining access for PUBLIC beaches for what several people have spent years trying to protect!

Good to know chris...

Seems like some people on here are getting bent out of shape because "some people" are being called out for riding in the swim zones, taunting life guards and disrespects people and authority figures...

I've got the solution to everyones problems and its easy:

1) Stay out of the swim zones, its good for everyone.

2) Just show some decent respect to the people trying to look out for you and other beach goers, because yes a lifeguard will come to save you even if you are being a pain in the ass kiteboarder!

Danny

respect the lifeguards
 

agree about respecting the life guards.

it's easy to piss and moan when your getting the whistle for riding too close. But doesn't the perspective change dramatically when you've crashed your kite and need assistance. Nobody is immune to an accident, and that is why these men and women are there.

I immediately think of the tragedy of Steve Shafer...that lifeguard put it on the line to save him. They would do it for you too.

Show respect, bottom line.

shame on the riders going inside the buoys on purpose. Very careless and selfish

-patrick

I'm not trying to be a smart ass but..... if you know the names & have pictures of them doing it, plus the lifeguards statements. Can't the police issue fines ? If that dosent work how about a little jail time for repeat offenders ?? Sounds like law enforcment needs to be alerted to the issue.

Need air to ride
 

Next time you catch one of these guys kites,
well just make sure that kite will not ever inflate again.

Self control is what we preach, so eliminate the tool that causes effect.
Post their names, type of kite and pics on these BBB. Front and center on a BLACK LIST. We probably even know where they live, locals right ?
We can police ourselves and we have worked hard and long to be able to ride in Ft.Laud.
If reasoning does not work, self policing will have to step up a notch.
Take the tool that gives them to act and strike back with it, disable the kite.

It is a rigorous step, I know, but we spend more combined on kites and gear then 4 or so idiots that don't share our view.
Unless they have endless amounts of cash, their sport they want so bad, will be not available to them.
Surfers in California protect their spots and we can too. Time to step up, we are with MORE, so we can do it.
Deflate them the last time, and we retain our access !! F**k them, so they won't do it to us !!

Immediate action required
 

Self policing was non existent and not enough in your face at Hobie Beach Miami. A and B's actions were clearly never challenged, nor did they look to scared doing something they knew not to do. As the videos clearly show. Very sad, and these guys are "instructors"

The same lack of action and indifference will get kiting in Fort Lauderdale banned.
We need to go after these local kooks and make sure in no uncertain terms and actions, that this terrible disrespect will never happen again.

We need to teach these dogs a few new things so they remember and respect Fort Lauderdale. Reasoning and just rules are not being respected.
And we have many "teachers" here in Ft. Lauderdale. We have all a common vested interest in this.

We can do it, control and spread the word.

1 cell phone + 1 camera + 1 phone call = fat fine and trespassing warrants, repeat as necessary.

Be sure to tell the cops you are also a kiter and don't want everyone to take the fall for these morons.

Neil,

I'm sure Jesse knows these guys. What is Liquid's stance on this? I'm surprised to see no responses or involvement from them. As just about the only Naish dealer, I'd guess that these guys may be customers of Liquid. If they are team riders of some sort for Naish, maybe Liquid could put some pressure on their vendor. We need everyone involved in this, especially the dealer in the area as they are pretty influential.

As for the one guy being on a Cabrinha, it's important to note that he is no sponsored in anyway by the brand.

No cops
 

I see some of you wants to get the cops involved. The problem with that is once you get the authorities involved and paper work is generated, it can be used against the sport later. They won't care or even mention that it was another kiter who called the cops or that these 4-5 guys were pissing off all of us.
Just a thought... I hope these guys grow up before the sport is banned from Ft Lauderdale, it will suck if instead of driving 1 mile I end up having to go drive to Dania or Pompano

Physical action is unacceptable, police may or may not become involved in enforcement, peer pressure is largely what we are left with. Instruct new riders what to do and not do as tactfully and effectively as you can. For experienced guys that are straining access, there has been quite a few over the years too all over, talk with them as effectively as you can. Breaking the rules, riding carelessly, annoying lifeguards and the authorities is bad for those doing it and the sport in general, that is obvious. We just need to work to get everyone on the same page.

I understand your hesitation, and I am one of the last people to want to call the cops and make reports. However, I do not think it will not necessarily add risk to losing the riding spots - to the contrary- ignoring it and not doing anything WILL probably result in losing spots.

Most police are pretty cool about things if approached the right way, unless they are there to investigate something and then are also treated to abuse and disrespect, as seems was the case recently.

I personally believe that if your initial , reasonable, non threatening discussion does not work with one of the A-hole riders out there, by all means call the cops - especially if you think there is a risk to public safety. My guess is that 9 out of 10 times the offender will get the boot. If he wises off...even better, he'll get hauled off for resisting an officer, possibly disturbing the peace, and whatever other charges they can dream up for the guy.

Better yet, if some of these guys have records, outstanding warrants, any other outstanding legal issues, - they're day probably just took a bad turn when the cops show up.

The police are there to protect the public. They will probably look at your efforts as assisting them rather than being a hassle. They probably even enjoy a trip to the beach.

Not sure about anyone else, but I'm sick of these idiots ruining it for everyone else. And sometimes I cannot believe that some of these issues even have to be discussed, or that some people actually try to justify or support the BS that is going down at the beaches all the time.

It's pretty much common sense...or total LACK of it.

Hi guys, you may notice that I deleted the names and photos on this post. This is getting much bigger than I expected. The reason that I put them up here was for the simple reason I can not be on the beach at every location, everytime it is windy to try and stop people from breaking the rules and jepodising our access. I need help from our community.
I in no way shape or form incurage any physical behaviour in dealing with these problems. People can be talked to and kites deflated. If that does not work then unfortunatly it will have to go to the authorities. If it does go that far who knows what might happen, it could even turn against us all as it is so much easier for city officials to ban us rarther than deal with ongoing problems, that they do not have the time for in the first place.
Our beaches will carry on getting busyer as time goes on but we need to set an example to the newcomers and instructors need to teach thier students more than just how to get up on a kite.
I love kiteboarding just as much as anyone, it is my passion, my job and a huge part of my life and it just turns my stomache that it could be gone at my local beach just because a couple of others think it would be easier that way.
Please, respect our rules, our beaches and our community.
Cheers...

All this hype because they went inside the bouys.... ha

Why not have the guys go sit down with the Ft. Lauderdale Beach Patrol and city police to discuss it and see how trivial the authorities think it was? Might clear things up and could be fun, likely an adrenaline rush too.

Enough already!!!
 

Still waiting for names and photo's of the guys.
Most every body wants to get on with this issue..

Quit deleting names and photo's.
We need to put these guys up online. so they feel the heat - next time they pump up their kite.

Locals step up. Take a page from how the surfers handled issues on their local surf break in CA.
Do not involve police - just get together and handle it.

Cheers
BVI-chris

Chris, that information was already up for a time. We need to move past that at this point and on to keeping things flying. Lots of ideas in circulation on how to try to do that. Peer pressure has done some amazing things but it comes with numbers. One or two guys with the commitment while the rest blow it off, won't work. We've done that lame approach for years, with poor results. Need to get more folks onboard with this, I think we've made a start.

I still don't understand the hesitation to take this up with the authorities.

To give an example - Last year there was a guy who drove his van like a mad man up and down the back alley separating our homes. People were worried about kids and pets being run down by this kook. A few neighbors yelled at him, cussed, and shook their heads in disbelief. If there was a neighborhood forum it would have made front page. Finally I got the license number, phoned police with a description of the car and driver. They obviously got in touch with this guy. I have not seen the guy since. And guess what...the rest of us can still drive our cars thru the alley at reasonable speed.

I really doubt that taking this swim zone issue up with the police will stop "things flying". On the contrary, doing nothing will probably have that undesired effect eventually. The longer you wait the less effective a formal report will be. They were clearly breaking some laws, there are witnesses - we pay taxes for the police to enforce the laws.

It may not be the final solution, but it's a start to some formal documentation. Sometimes peer pressure brings around results, but these guys have an aggenda and they are not likely to see the stupidity of their "kiting for columbine" mentality.

IMO - Just do it (file a report), before it's too late and this is no longer an option. By backing off and laying low you are empowering these nut jobs, and they are probably just having a good chuf about it.

I don't condone it, but if someone thinks "California style" beach control would work, try it at your own risk and be willing to pay the price...but at least it would be doing "something" about it.

Writing about it on the forum is a good way to get the word out, but that in itself will probably not accomplish anything. Nobody on this forum has any authority other than to ban a member from the forum.

There is no hesitation, I've spent many hours talking about this very subject with law enforcement on several occasions in a bunch of jurisdictions over quite a few years. Neil has likely spent even more time than me at it in Ft. Lauderdale. It sounds good, logical and easy just like not having this idiotic problem in the first place. The reality is, it often isn't that simple for varying reasons. That doesn't mean we won't keep trying for assistance from law enforcement, because we still are. Just spoke to two officers about this subject in another jurisdiction last week for a couple of hours. They may help or they may not be able to offer much assistance depending on how things transpire. That brings it back to us.

Sounds good, I hope something comes out of these efforts.

Unfortunately it seems like there will always be these "renegades" who make it necessary for others to deal with their idiotic problem. Which is another reason I support turning it over to someone who is paid to handle it.

Good luck getting this sorted over there on the FL East Coast. It's really a shame to see how bad it has gotten. It's too bad that such a prime riding area has become such a "proving ground" for these issues and how to resolve them - but people should be aware that this sort of thing/stupid behaviour can/and does happen everywhere.

Some have been posing this as a vendetta against "kids." Nothing could be further from the truth. Also, once you are into your 20's, you are kind of stuck leaving the kid label behind.

None of us have anything against kids or anyone else (up to and including grandparents either), having fun. We just want to fun to continue without bans and harsh restrictions. You know, people telling you what to do. Make the right choices, they won't bother. It's easy to avoid bans and hassles, stay out of guarded areas, go as extreme as you want without threatening others, ideally well offshore, avoid complaints ... and you're there.

How clear are the rules, really?
 

This discussion assumes that the kiters that caused the issue knew the rules and purposely broke them. That may be true in this case, but how clear are the rules really? There was quite a bit of discussion recently on this site about kiting inside the buoys near Tampa, and most of that was between experts. So how is a beginner or visitor supposed to figure it out?

I don't know about Ft Lauderdale, but at my kitespots in Cocoa there are signs with rules for parking, boating, fishing, and warnings for swimmers but nothing about kiting. It would be nice if we could come up with a standard sign with a couple of (reasonable) rules and get someone to make them, and then, with approval from local authorities and help from local clubs/schools put them up at popular spots. Having the rules posted will make it a lot easier to confront people that break the them and will also show the authorities that we are reasonable and willing to work with them.

Nick

We've tried to put signs up in many jurisdictions over almost ten years. More often than not, they are not allowed. In a few cases they have been. Putting signs up sounds simple but the reality is complex for kiteboarding signs in the public sector.

There have been signs up in Matheson Hammock for years, how many people pay attention to them? What has been missing , until recently, is enough people trying to enforce what is on the signs. Understand things are improving in that regard.

The responsibility is ours to pass the word out, like it or not. Riders should always ask about and be aware of rules, guidelines where they kite. Help promote them. Talk to locals, shops or schools, ask on here. If we don't know, we'll sure try to find out.

Good rules of thumb, ask informed locals, stay out of guarded areas, buoyed/marked swim areas unless there is a designated launch. If there is a designated launch, learn what the guidelines are before you rig up. Stay away from crowds, don't ride among bathers, don't walk with your lines upwind of nearby bystanders. Common sense stuff.

?...I didn't pick anything like that up.
Personally, I don't care if it's a 10 year old or a 60 year old. They need to be busted.


There may be a few spots where unique rules apply. Anyone with common sense would stop to check, ask local kiters, ask the guards if there was ANY question. If someone says they did not understand the rules this is in most cases pleading total ignorance (and that's not a valid defense) or else they are "playing stupid" - which I see all the time. Either approach is unacceptable.

Most new riders have been thru lesssons. I spend at least 30 minutes going over thses issues in classroom, and then these principles are carried thru onto the water. I know for a fact that a lot of instructors do not cover this subject appropriately - often times because they are conducting their lessons in conditiiions where they would appear to be hypocritical. So some duty lies with the instructors...but in the end it is up to the individual to use good judgement in all circumstances.

I believe that it would be conservative to say that most of the people violating the rules much of the time are a handful of the experts. Newbies do it too but mostly because of lack of ability or unfamiliarity with a spot and special rules that might be posted. Again, neither is acceptable, but the experienced riders know better and should be leading by example and not corrupt the sport.

I have been at kiting for years but I have limited amounts of time due to work, family etc so my learning curve has suffered. Until last year this sport was available to me only when I visited my condo in Pompano the Atlantis building. For years I have never had a problem with setting up, launching and I would purposely drag out past the buoys which for me is pretty far but I do it to try and follow the rules. Now lately withing a year I have noticed that you can't even come ashore without being hassled by a guard from a tower 1/4 mile away. I have also noticed these guard towers have been coming from 16th and are now at almost all the public access spots, sure hope they don't make it down by me. I was down back around thanks giving I think there were only a couple of days with decent wind and did notice a small group come in tight to the shore close enough to where people had to duck as they changed directions. I myself thought it was cool but have noticed that people are getting scared of this stuff which is extremely bad! Now I can say I just got back from Pompano yesterday I was there from the 18th to the 1st and I had a great time. We had a few good wind days that lasted all day it allowed me to wait till a good amount of people left the beach before I came out. This time around I did not see any kiters bouncing off the shore line. Now I have a friend that knows I drop in from time to time and he may come in to talk to me or tell me hello but he quickly heads back out and never pops any tricks. I hope we don't lose access it would be a shame because one of the only reasons I come down is to kite, other than Piranha Pat's.

Polo..;)

You can thank kiters riding too close to shore for the following:

Kiting is permitted in only two places within 100 yards of shore in the City of Pompano. Both are launching corridors and not for routine riding inside the buoys. We are very fortunate to still have those two spots. NE 13 and 16th Streets. Rules are posted on signs there.

I understand we had a guy grandstanding close to shore recently at NE 16th St., a sponsored team rider too. He may not have known better (uh right), but thanks to Brian of ASM, he sure does now to stay out of the swim zone. Way to go Brian and to everyone else working to keep things flying at your local launches.

Not trying to sound like a a-hole but from following this thread beginner or not it seems when you are riding close to shore and lifeguards are blowing their whistles to wave you away, or authorities on ATV's are trying to get your attention there doesn't have to be anything posted to know to respect authority, IMO, thats a respect/common sense issue. Most beginners at the sound of a whistle and waving life guards might actually come to shore to talk to the lifeguard who could probably explain the rules.

The deal in Tampa is about riding inside buoys that say "No combustion engines" vs a designated swim zone area and deals with a race with 80 people riding through the beach during spring/spring break crowds.

That issue also goes back to common sense, i.e. not riding close to shore with swimmers.

Anyway, I hope this issue gets worked out down there!

Danny

I have visited Florida and other locations many times, every responsible kiter knows to check the local rules at any local spot. I can not think of a kiter I know that would not check the local rules before riding a spot. I knew months and months before I came to Fort Lauderdale not to ride in the swim buoys. I knew from common sense not to cut so close to swimmers that they get sprayed with the water off my board! Yet, on all my trips to Fort Lauderdale area I see locals doing both of these obvious things. Very few can claim ignorance on this issue in my opinion.

Actually, now that I think about it Fort Lauderdale is/was the worst spot in terms of kiters being respectful to the general public of any location I have ever kited out. When I was recently in the keys everyone seemed pretty respectful of the bystanders


Here is the lists of places I have ridden off the top of my head, all spots were good except Fort Lauderdale...I will say that at Leo Carillo in CA, the lifeguards I talked to said some people were pretty bad, but not while I was there

FL
Curry Hammock State Park
Fort Lauderdale Area

HI
Kailua Bay
Various local spots around Kauai

CA
Leo Carillo / Nicholas Canyon

NE
Lake McConaughy

OK
Foss Lake

MI
Tawas
Sterling State Part
Lake St. Clair

NC
OBX

Puerto Rico
Varios local spots

Mexico
Rocky Point