glad to see we're all on the same page:)

I was there last Friday when folks were launching or walking through. Stood there for 15 min surveying the situation. Concluded that the up draft potential to pick you up and land you in the trees or road is way too real.

Pumped up the kite carried my bar, board, and kite unrigged ( upside down) through the opening walked out over a hundred yards to the NNE. Put the kite leading edge down on the dry grass flat with the board on the leading edge and walk the lines out in 2" of water hooked it all up and put the kite into the shallow water let the lines come tight to the SW and water launched. I was never anywhere near the mangroves or another kiter. My riding buddy and I landed each others kite in the same area rolled up the lines and carried the kites back.

The post of the kiter that got hammered and dragged over 600' in Jupiter was the result of a very simular set up. The updraft that lofted him was onshore wind hitting a sand wall caused by beach errosion but the shape of the ridge line is the same be it treeline of mangroves, a building, or a sand dune. Rember the depower on a kite doesn't work effectivly if the wind is hitting it from the underside.

BTW Scott, I hope you don't get to win or loose your bet.

I wouldn't bet on something like that, no worries.

I don't want to see anyone get hurt either. I just know that saying it a particular way fails, so I say it another way.

kite free or DIE!

I am always a little nervous, I guess... Kitemares are very easy to see unfold from a distance and there's nothing you can do about it. Us seasoned kiters have all seen them, and try to prevent them as much as we can. Scraping your friend up off the ground kinda sucks...
I have seen way too many close calls for comfort, and most of the time its an avoidable mistake. Lack of knowledge should not be one of those, and this is why we preach... We are all bros and want to help the new guys become safe and independent, and we are all smarter because of it. We also happen to have about a dozen local instructors in the area, and probably half of them post on here. Most areas don't have that, so absorb the knowledge, be thankful that we have the beautiful spots to ride, and lets all work hard to protect them. The newer kites aren't any different than the old ones as far as safety goes, I know that my "100% Depower" kite could kill me if I make a mistake. Its in the hands of the operator to have good judgement, and plenty of respect for the kite, mother nature, mishaps,malfunctions, and freak accidents.
bE sAfE hOmEy!.!.!

Unfortunately with kitemares it takes one to know one.

But we ALL make compromises... launching or catching a kite while flying your own ... rescuing a buddy's lost kite ... trying to carry a friends board back up wind while riding... self launching in hairy spots ... any of these things are playing with fire and we have all have played with fire at some point... who hasn't?

The most important part is to KNOW when you are playing with fire so you can decide whether or not it's a game you want to play.

After that it's game on as long as you are prepared to get burned!

Yeah I'm stating the obvious here but it's 3am and I love metaphors.

Wow Tom, that was a metaphoric montage of epic proportions!
Would you like another glass of wine?:p

Was visiting Naples this sunday, went to 7th ave south, wind died and went NE. packed up and went to moms house just south of the Edgewater Hotel. Said what the hell and rigged my 16m on the beach just in case, the breeze filled NW, had two good sessions in the afternoon. Saw some guys doing a downwinder. It was good to finally have kited Naples, nice and warn with sandy beaches. Great day except for Maryland losing to Duke!

In kiteboarding??? ;)

Ok my 2 cents and so nobody gets anything confused I have labeled my responses and joking and not joking.

This is the part where I'm not joking:

I launched and walked through the mangroves and had no problem. Not ideal by any means.

Steve Sadler was doing it properly and I wish more people were out there to see him setting a good example.

Also, Scott, I like the pics.

Now the part where I am joking:

Scott, about the pictures, there are three in particular that I noted.

1) a guy riding in what appears to be puddles
2) someone close to the mangroves
3) A picture of Bryan and Toby

With your track record of safety I think that if newbies see those two pictures they will think that its ok to ride in puddles and near trees.

And the picture of Bryan and Toby standing so close to each other might scare off people from our sport. So WAIT, maybe you should leave that one up!

That's a pretty good point.
They are gone now.

BTW, someone almost got hurt REAL bad today at EB. It was on a launch. I didn't see it, but heard he was literally inches from a serious head injury. I guess the rider ended up pinned under the front end of my truck (parked at the edge of the road) after being dragged about 75 yards at high speed.
He was hauling ass with his kite looping repeatedly.
I was told his head was one inch from colliding with the underside of my truck.
Several people told me the exact same story and I guess at least ten people saw it, so it's not exaggeration.

I guess another launch went bad and the guy got dragged to the other side across the road, too.

Very glad no one was seriously hurt. I then heard about 5 other stories of recent kitemares over the last month or so.
Every single one was associated with a launch.
Not bringing it up to be negative. Just bringing it up to reinforce that launching (imo) is the most dangerous thing we do and unfortunately, most people are pretty lax during a launch.
Stuff can go wrong, that much is certain.
If it does during a launch, it's usually pretty brutal cuz the kite is somewhat out of control for one reason or another.

Just play it safe on the launches. :)

Use those exit rings. That is what they are there for. Can make a QR situation actually work. Putting your leash on the chicken loop may not always do the trick. Some kites have these rings on the back line, some on the front line. Either way, they can kill the kite if used.

I know some of the closest calls I have had have been on a launch. I definately think most kiteboarders practice their latest trick instead of practicing using their QR.

Glad no one got hurt!!!!!!!!!

They don't call 'em SUICIDE leashes for nothin'
Glad they're both O.K.
Glad that I didn't see it and add to my kitemare nightmare collection.
Take those distances and imagine the kitemare(s) at the Skyway.(Either side):confused:
Later

Tom dug up so old pics for me off of his old forum (the hard drive associated with it, actually).
Thanks Tom.

I went ahead and loaded them up. Some are pretty old, most look to be about 3 years old.

http://web.mac.com/scottfears/Site/S...s/Vintage.html

anyone have more info on the accident at EB yesterday?

new rider? etc??

I know there was a guy on a 11m red 2008 waroo that looked to be having a hard time .. I helped him launch once and he didnt seem to know where to be in relation to the kite.. i had to readjust myself w/ his kite to get it at the edge of the window for a launch. initially he was very upwind of the kite.. could have been bad if I had not known what i was doing.

he was a definite beginner..

saw a few others that looked to be new to the sport..

hope whomever it was is OK and can call it a "lesson learned"..

That was the good old days!!!!!!
Some very CLASSIC shots in there
Thanks for the memories, let's make some new ones!!!!
later

Thanks Steve. That one shot I have of you board dragging is one of my all time favorites. Just good lighting, etc.

I am going to start taking more shots, like Amber and some others.
I just got this iMac giggie and can upload pics easily, so may as well.

Yep, thats the shot that made it into The Kiteboarder mag! Now my body dragging skillz are known worldwide and I get harrassed by the papparazi every time I leave the house...(NOT):(
I really like the one of Zack doing the 1 footer, His tongue is extended almost as much as his leg!
Notice how everyone is much slimmer and trimmer now?
Good stuff!

That shot was in a mag? Funny.
I wouldn't know, I avoid that propaganda like the plague.
I think one of Jay was in the SP Times.
We have a much better selection of shots these days for things like mags and papers, thanks to others taking great shots, but I will post mine anyway since it's easy to do.

I'm famous too. I made it onto a magazine cover once. Beat that! wahaha

http://www.2600.com/covers/sp961.gif

Yep, in a beginner's guide section. Eagle had a whole page on gear maintenance in the same issue.

Since we are talking about the "good old days" and everything:

Once upon a time, we could tell who was who and all knew each others names and skill levels, and who they took lessons from. Now, we have hundreds of kiters here, many instructors, and many new faces every day, its very hard to keep up. I believe that over the past few years, we have become too relaxed about safety,the learning curve/timeline, "cowboys", and kooks. Now it appears to be acceptable for inexperienced kiters to buy a kite (on the beach) and learn as they go, which only increases the risk factor. That's not healthy for the future of our sport, and we should all work together towards the common goal of safer launches, and making EVERY kiter self sufficient and confident in their abilities.
Becoming a kiter starts with LESSONS, not with a kite purchase.
Kite safe

That classic pic of Chris Moore looking gay at PAG with his new board is on there too, Chris and I were talking about that pic just yesterday!!! LOL!!!

As a new kiter, I've considered launch and landing the most sketchy times for an accident to occur, and the discussion about the accident at EB reinforced my ideas. I've really wondered if my kite went crazy on the launch would I have enough instinct to know what to do in that rapid fire couple of seconds. I know the topic of whether or not to launch hooked in or not always brings up lengthy debates, so I don't want to start that one. When I lauch, I do it hooked in, and take a couple glances at my QR so I know where to grab. My leash is hooked into the ring under my bar(Best bar), the way I was taught by my instructor. Obviously with that setup, my option would be to let go of the bar and pull the QR. My question is: would it be wiser(especially as a newb) to attach the leash to the O-S webbing that way the kite would flag if I had a problem, and then move the leash to below the bar when I'm on the water? It seems like a better idea, and I'm assuming most people aren't taught this way by their instructors simply because its more of a hassle.
Opinions?
Richard

I keep my leash fastened where it started because moving the attachment point would involve unattaching your leash while your kite is in the air. While it isn't likely that you would need to throw your bar during that couple of seconds that you are making the transition, you never know when a gust will hit or something will go wrong with your gear. Plus, as you get more comfortable making that transition of leash attachment points, you would naturally become less cautious while doing it. Just my take on it, dont want to see any more 'runaway kites' than we have to, others may disagree with me though...

LSU.

Most kites have the option to attach a leash that will flag the kite. I will admit that if the wind is not crazy and I have lots of room, I will attach the leash below the bar. However, if I feel I have alot of wind/power on tap, sticky launch area, or just feel that I want to be able to "get out", then I attach to an exit ring. Once the launch is completed, then I switch the leash back over to below the bar.

I do teach my students about the hidden dangers of attaching your leash in a convenient place vs. a safe place. If the wind ever suddenly picked up, or something goes terribly wrong, and your leash wasn't on your exit ring, well.....you could be in trouble.

I do wish more kite companies would address this issue of convenience vs. safety.

I do not like the rings attached to the flying lines however. It makes for a big mess. I do like the rings attached to the center lines, but not as easy to get to.

Props to the companies that have safe, below the bar, flag points.

I won't name any names, but I remember a time in October that a front came through, I did not have my kite up, but plenty of others did, and out of no where the wind spiked from 15-18 to like 30+.

Steve-O you may remember this, but a guy on a 16 switchblade 2 who had his leash hook-up for convenience got lofted and dragged onto the sandbar.

He was lucky that there were people there to assist. this is a good example of a close call where the exit ring would have made all the difference.

LSUKiter, if you launch hooked in, don't just look at your quick release, keep your HAND ON IT until the kite is overhead and stable... if it suddenly loops you will have to look down to grab it and trust me when I say you are not going to succeed.

Honestly I don't recommend connecting to an outside line during launch (on a waroo or other bow kite). If you have a bar with velcro on that ring, and you forget to undo it, or if you clip into the wrong ring (there are two on the end of the bar) you are in for the worst possible kitemare you can imagine.

Odds are good you will forget or get the wrong ring at some point in your life.

My personal solution is not the best solution, but it is the most convenient solution.

1) I launch hooked in with my hand on the QR, and I do not connect my leash until the kite is in the air. Not the best, but safe from kite loops as long as I pull the release.

2) A an even safer method which Steve-O mentioned awhile back is to launch with the chicken loop in your hand (unhooked) and one hand on the bar. Done that too... also no leash connected until after launch. Works ok, but you could loose your kite if you slip and fall or something.

Whats the safest method to launch a bow with "full" depower?

3) Launch unhooked by holding the chicken loop (fully depowered) in one hand,one hand on bar, with leash connected to a front line.

All good advice Tom.

Just to clarify, I never mentioned the chicken loop in hand idea. Might be confusing that with someone else. No biggie.

There are all kinds of methods to be safe, you just have to find what works best for you. The time to figure this out is not when you are in trouble, but to practice releasing the kite in a controlled area with lighter winds. Just to see what is going to happen so you know what to expect.

Center line rings are the best option IMO, and can easily be put on alot of kites that don't have them. Usually kites without pulleys on the bar have the rings on the back lines which as stated can be a mess. Yes and if hooked up wrong, you are even in bigger trouble.

Moral of the story, educate yourself on all aspects of the kites safety and practice using them all.

I like the kites that have the below bar safety ring and allow you to flag the kite in this same ring. What could be better???

I know of some.....are there others?

Ozone
Rev
Flexi ION (in 5 line setting)
North Kites
5 Line C kites
Blade

What other companies are using this safety as part of their design???

Yes Danny, that rings a bell.

this is why i switched to 5th liners for higher wind, anything over 15 and im on 5 lines... :)
the good thing about 5 lines is that if you do get in trouble and cant find the QR, all you need to do is grab your leash and pull a good 1-2ft... that will pull the nose of the kite just enough to dump most of the power, unless its a 16m + kite, that would require more then 2ft.... but on my 12m, if i pull one foot of the 5th, the kite starts to fall out of the air, it obviously wouldnt stop a looping kite, but the pull would be reduced drastically

Freak Dog Kites also have below the bar safety (front line) and it works excellent. Instant flagging with no looping or pull.
Slingshot surefire spreader bar adds a very simple way out(hit the button) in addition to the normal quick release. Easier to hit the button than to find a loop, grab it effectively and pull it. I use these for all my students as an added safety precaution. I would like to see manufacturers improve this already smart design.