60 miles an hour was recorded in Long beach CA(video)

[fafa]

check this guy out with his lish ...dumb ass
http://www.youkiteboard.com/view_video.php?viewkey=b408017b62254211691b

you have to check his replies...that's how some beaches get banned

[tomstock]

What a F@#$tard. Using a board leash too! Good thing he didn't get lofted, he'd have broken his legs then his board would have taken off his head.

I can't believe he hot launched in 60mph, foil or not!

[E-Bone]

Yeah, this guy is a tool. Give me a f***ing break, the board leash really shows how pathetic this guy's thinking was. What a no-skillz tool. It's funny that Toby is hazing his ass in the comments section.

[toby wilson]

I am just sick of seeing this kind of stupid kooky crap and have decided to start opening my mouth whenever I see someone (to put it nicely) making a mistake and putting themselves and/or others as well as our launches in danger. I have had more close calls with people being unsafe and almost running into me in the last month than I have over the rest of the time that I have been riding. It is really getting dangerous just being out there standing on the beach.

Amber (and Erick while helping me teach her how to launch and land her kite) almost got taken out this weekend by an out-of-control newbie learning from a more experienced rider just 10 yards offshore at Skyway North. The newbie got drug into her new kite and luckily didn't get caught in her lines.

If you are teaching newbies (especially at SWN), please walk out to the sandbar, and especially if they are working on water starts.

[bryanleighty]

Really not trying to be an azzhole but the "experienced" rider really needs to be talked to. I am not thinking of anyone needing to post names on this forum, but someone needs to make clear that this is not acceptable.

[tomstock]

I was out there the other day... SSW, 8mph, 4mph on the beach. 12 kites in the air!! In 6-10mph?! What!

Imagine what a 15-20mph day will look like in 2 years!

I couldn't even find anywhere to lay out my lines, so I headed off somewhere else to ride in peace.

This sort of thing is exactly why I decided against becoming an instructor. I calculated that to make a living, I would need to teach between 78 and 150 students per year. Figure half of those are locals, and only half of them continue with the sport. That would leave at least 20 - 40 beginners per year from just me alone. In two years we would have between 40 and 80 new riders at the skyway in exchange for my new career, and that wouldn't include the numerous other instructors in the area.

I ultimately decided that whatever money I would make would never replace the riding locations the whole community would loose due to over crowding.

Don't get me wrong, my intent is not to bash instructor, they do a fine job and are generally great guys who work hard, and most have been riding longer than I have (but not all).

But the sad fact is that promoting this sport means over crowding our favorite riding locations. And when a large chunk of that crowd are beginners, the number of accidents will increase quickly.

Have a look at Sunset or Upham beach on a good day of surfing.... riders sitting shoulder to shoulder as far as you can see. That's a whole gulf beach... we only have a handful of good East wind locations, each smaller than half of a football field.

Our sport is fermenting. :(

[toby wilson]

Already taken care of. I am not so nice anymore when someone is throwing caution to the wind like that. I started yelling at him asking what he thought he was doing. He apologized and I said that his apology wouldn't be of much help if someone had gotten hurt. I then asked why he did not have the newbie out at the sandbar and he said, and I quote "I hadn't gotten to that yet". That pissed me off so I got on his case some telling him that he should know better than that and should have ridden the kite out to the sandbar in the first place PRIOR to handing the kite off to a completely inexperienced rider.

A woman in street clothes standing on the beach (probably the newbies' Mother) started yelling at me saying that I was over reacting and that it wasn't a big deal, he didn't do anything and no harm was done. Let's just say that she and I won't be doing lunch anytime soon...I just don't think that people "get" it and treat these kites like toys, it's good to be nice but sometimes you have to stop being nice and hit them with a scenario of what could have happened.

He finally had the newbie walk out to the first bit of sandbar off to the right side of the beach, basically the least amount of walking possible for the newbie. One power stroke and he was back in everyones lanes. Amber and I walked off to the left pretty much as far out on the sandbar as I could take her to practice her water starts. She actually got up for about 3 power strokes and had to stop when she saw the other newbie dead in the water ahead of her (in the riding lanes).

This guy had been doing backrolls about 10 yards offshore the day before and sometimes having to ditch the board and hit the ground running both that day and the day before. Basically, you could see it coming.

Like I said in my prior post, I am sick of the lack of caution being used on the water this year. I don't care if someone gets his ego bruised or ends up not liking me as a result, I'm gonna speak up going forward when I see crazy behavior on the water.

[bryanleighty]

22+ kites in air at EB 2 fridays ago.

many riders (experienced locals) not giving ample room for others to leave or come into the beach. no close calls that I saw, but I got very annoyed with guys throwing tricks at the waters edge at mid-beach location. not cool especially w/ so many people.

Some were throwing them more down wind and I thought that was better (still too close to the beach in my opinion)

Difficult to judge distance sometimes.. you might be a kite length away.. but so are they.. if both kites come down on same tack you are both in for trouble.

I stayed way up or down wind the entire day and had a blast. Saw lots of close calls in the middle.

It is getting crazy .. its getting more and more crowded and we need to police our beaches ourselves..


its been posted about a billion times of what we need to do .. but it comes down to the more experienced riders needing to ensure others dont hurt themselves or others. I feel that if you have a full season of riding experience you have a responsibility to do what you can to keep potential problems from occuring..

no attitudes .. just keep our riding spots safe.

[toby wilson]

No attitude, the newbie was not AT ALL at fault here and I feel bad that he had to hear me frustrated with his "instructor". He was not given proper safety direction and I think ALL of us need to get a quick reminder of what is and what isn't the right thing to do sometimes. Everyone makes mistakes, it is how you learn from those mistakes that is the most important thing.

[E-Bone]

Yeah, failing to walk out to the sandbar as a newbie is a dumb move because you can't learn anything that way, except how to do the walk of shame. If you walk out 100 feet and then ride left or right, you are soon in chest-high or deeper water and you either have to stay upwind or you wash down onto the rocky beach. Because going upwind is usually not an option for newbies because of lack of skillz, they are on the beach next to the road everytime, especially in light wind.

If you walk out to the sandbar as a newbie with the kite at 45 degrees, however, you can ride, stop when you f*ck up, then walk easily back to the edge of the sandbar and start again. You can make a ton of progress there because it is shallow and you can easily gain (on foot) any ground you lose on the board without tiring out by struggling in the depper water. I tell this to beginners over and over and I am usually ignored, but just inside the sandbar is really the best place to ride at the Skyway. Hell, I prefer riding there myself, just because the water conditions are usually better, with less current and chop, and the wind is much cleaner there, as well.

Props to Toby by bringing Amber out there, but aside from a chill 5 minute walk, it's really not a sacrifice. Instead, it's the smart thing to do if you want to develop some skillz.

[tomstock]

Bryan I am with you on the jumping close to shore and riding to the beach on every tack. There is NOTHING more frustrating than standing on the beach having to MOVE YOUR KITE out of the way, over to the parked cars, just so that some fool can ride all the way up to the beach to change tacks.

That combined with people jumping 10 feet from shore so they can take pictures is just an accident waiting to happen.

Toby, way to go.

[toby wilson]

Thanks guys but it is just using common sense and some courtesy to the more advanced kiters...as well as watching Amber's back! I feel good knowing she is learning way out there and has a MUCH lower chance of injury as a newbie...I haven't been trained as an instructor so I think erring on the side of caution is the way to go when helping her learn.

I think the jumping close to shore for pictures thing can be easily taken care of by spending a couple of extra bucks on a better zoom lens...plus, all pics can be zoomed in on using most of the better digital cameras today even after the picture has been taken so there is no need for coming near shore unless you are changing your board (quickly) or landing your kite...

[tomstock]

Well, I think a lot of guys jump near shore when they are trying complex tricks because they don't want to relaunch in deep water.

I've heard plenty of stories recently about kites being dropped on people's heads due to this sort of thing.

Seems like it would be a better idea to do this over a sandbar instead of right near shore.

[Steve-O]

Just wanted to let everyone know that we are very aware of the crowded conditions in Tampa Bay. Population over 4 million + bow kites making it easier to learn + experienced riders throwing down awesome tricks is bringing more and more people into the sport. We have seen a huge increase in interest for the sport just over the past few months.

At WSW west we recognize the need to keep our riding spots safe and make every newbie aware that riding these spots on crowded days is a very risky situation. I personally stress to all my students to walk out into the water to launch and land, and go way out to the sandbars to work on their board skills. Staying in winds under 15 knots and getting your skills under control on less populated weekdays is the safe way to approach learning the sport until things are under control.

We have also chosen to teach the majority of our students in the less accessible northern locations of Pinellas county ie. Caladesi, Honeymoon, and 3-rooker. If you do see me teaching students out there it is simply our ground school program with no board involved. Most of the work is stationary with the kite, and it will not be on busy weekends.

We have a great deal of respect for the dangers of mixing experienced crowds and newbies together and will do everything within our power to educate our students via video, one on one instruction, and ultimately moving the learning environment to a different location. After they leave our program, we can only hope these newbies will make smart choices not only for themselves but for the others.

Peace!

[tomstock]

That's encouraging info Steve-O! I didn't know you were teaching now for WSW. How long have you been teaching/riding and which organization are you certifying students through (PASA or IKO)?

[Steve-O]

As I am sure you know, Randy was our main instructor in 06. He is doing his own thing now and we truly wish him well. My background is in education with a bachelor's and master's degree. I have worked with literally thousands of kids and adults in the marching band world....coordinating shows with my last post at the University of South Florida in Tampa. Basically, my job was breaking down very complex skills for my students and challenging them to the highest level. Long story short, I am confident of my ability to teach and communicate with all walks of life. It is something I have done since I was 18.

I have been a waterman of over 20 years now challenging the shores of Costa Rica, Hawaii, California, and Puerto Rico. Many near drownings in these locations. They are the real deal.

Anyways, I take this responsibilty very seriously and am always promoting safe practices for my students just as I did. I have only been riding a year now, but have put quite a bit of time on the water as it is part of my job. I didn't even ride at the Skyway/Ft. Desoto area until I had my game together which took about 6 months.

As far as certifications, WSW is sending me to the Kitehouse to study with Paul Menta and receive a Level 1 instructor cert. through PASA. This should be completed in the next few weeks. I will have to teach for one full year until I am able to certify students through PASA. We eventuly plan to be a certified PASA school.

We are moving forward to educate on a very professional level and offer the best instruction in the bay area. This sport is amazing and for better or for worse more and more are going to get involved. Since my involement, I now have 5 surfing friends that are on there way to entering the sport. As prices go down, and safety goes up, it is only a matter of time until this sport is as mainstream as surfing. But education is key. I think we can all agree on that.

Again, a good majority of our teaching will not take place in the Skyway/Desoto area. The risks are too high and new people coming into the sport need to be educated and steered in the right direction to explore spots that aren't quite so crowded.

We all need to work together to educate and assist those entering the sport, because the bottom line is we were all there once.

Steve-O

[tomstock]

As I am sure you know, Randy was our main instructor in 06. He is doing his own thing now and we truly wish him well. My background is in education with a bachelor's and master's degree. I have worked with literally thousands of kids and adults in the marching band world....coordinating shows with my last post at the University of South Florida in Tampa. Basically, my job was breaking down very complex skills for my students and challenging them to the highest level. Long story short, I am confident of my ability to teach and communicate with all walks of life. It is something I have done since I was 18.

I have been a waterman of over 20 years now challenging the shores of Costa Rica, Hawaii, California, and Puerto Rico. Many near drownings in these locations. They are the real deal.

Anyways, I take this responsibilty very seriously and am always promoting safe practices for my students just as I did. I have only been riding a year now, but have put quite a bit of time on the water as it is part of my job. I didn't even ride at the Skyway/Ft. Desoto area until I had my game together which took about 6 months.

As far as certifications, WSW is sending me to the Kitehouse to study with Paul Menta and receive a Level 1 instructor cert. through PASA. This should be completed in the next few weeks. I will have to teach for one full year until I am able to certify students through PASA. We eventuly plan to be a certified PASA school.

We are moving forward to educate on a very professional level and offer the best instruction in the bay area. This sport is amazing and for better or for worse more and more are going to get involved. Since my involement, I now have 5 surfing friends that are on there way to entering the sport. As prices go down, and safety goes up, it is only a matter of time until this sport is as mainstream as surfing. But education is key. I think we can all agree on that.

Again, a good majority of our teaching will not take place in the Skyway/Desoto area. The risks are too high and new people coming into the sport need to be educated and steered in the right direction to explore spots that aren't quite so crowded.

We all need to work together to educate and assist those entering the sport, because the bottom line is we were all there once.

Well.. taking Toby's perspective on safety....

I'm sure you've heard this quote before:

"Nah... I don't need lessons. I've been surfing and skateboarding forever... I can do it no problem, I just need to buy the gear."

I think this applies MORE so for teaching. You are taking someone's life into your hands when you attach them to that kite.

This isn't marching band, in this sport if you teach someone a bad habit (like reaching for the quick release when it suddenly goes from 15 to 35) it could possibly get them killed. Ask me how I know about that one.

The only exceptions to this (for me anyway) are the long timers (Randy, Jeff, and a few others) who have been riding since the jojo. I don't know how long you've been riding but your name doesn't ring a bell to me.

Obviously I don't know you or your capabilities, but I know what you liabilities are, as well as those of water sports west. I would strongly urge you to get certified before teaching anyone other than close friends. How are you going to explain the situation to someone's family at the hospital when you tell them you are not a certified instructor? How is WSW going to defend themselves in court? Man, I would be careful if I were you until you get that cert done. I do appreciate your attitude towards safety and responsibility at the spots though...

If I am way off base I apologize ... I am prepared to get flamed over this one but I just couldn't let it go without speaking up. This is what self regulation of our sport is all about.

[C. Moore]

Tom.. I need to stickup for Steve-O. I have seen him give lessons and he is doing everything in his power to give safe lessons. He is doing a great job and he hasn't put students in harms way.

I am glad that WSW is not just selling gear to people but also stepping up to the plate and giving lessons.

Thanks Steve-O for your contibution on making our sport safe.

[Steve-O]

Thanks Chris. I do appreciate it the support.

As far as certification, Randy has taught for the shop for quite a long time with no certification, nor was he interested to get one. We are sorry to loose him but it now allows us to move in the right direction which is better for all.

As in my last profession, a teaching certificate does not guarantee you will be an effective teacher. I knew plenty of teachers that couldn't teach to save their lives let alone others. I look forward to working with Paul Menta and seeing how he does things especially from a boat and away from danger.

I certainly don't expect anyone to think that teaching marching band relates to teaching kiting but I was very good at what I did in that arena. And it is teaching lots of mechanical skills and judgement. I had a 3 time Florida State champ band, and traveled around the country teaching some of the best of the best in an ESPN arena. I am not just your average teacher, but someone that goes the extra mile to achieve excellence at a very high level. One of the reasons I left teaching is I achieved too much too quickly. Call it burnout. I went hard at it and fell fast.

Watersports has been a passion of mine since I was a kid and so was teaching. Now I get to combine both of my passions and I am looking forward to this new chapter in my life. It has been a natural progression.

I do appreciate the advice, and believe me we are covering ourselves legally. But we are excited about moving towards PASA certification.

Finally, I don't see how teaching close friends is any less of an issue than teaching strangers. It is still a responsibility and a trip to the hospital wouldn't be any easier. If anything, it would be even harder to see them get hurt.

Steve-O

[tomstock]

Well, Randy has been riding for 7 years though.

You may interact well with students and be well organized and detail oriented, but without certification you can only teach what you know from real life experience. Your experience IS based on your riding experience until you are certified.

How long have you been riding?

Self regulation of our sport means ruffling feathers now and then, right?

[Steve-O]

After reading many concerns about our local spots, the crowds, and some of the reckless riding that has been going on, I just wanted to take an opportunity to let the community know that I recongnize these issues and as an instructor will continue to teach away from these spots. I would only hope this will be appreciated by seasoned riders not having to deal with a lesson in the middle of all of the hoopla. I have witnessed some close calls and recklessness myself this past season with newbies and seasoned riders alike. All the instruction in the world can still not replace common sense, good judgement, and experience.

I belive Josh Taylor received some excellent instruction from Brian Eagle, but still suffered a bad injury in his early days of kiting. Should Josh's accident be blamed on his instruction? I think not.

We have all had some close calls and walked away. Others have not. It is the risk we take everytime we put the thumbs up sign and launch our kites.

Instruction allows a beginner a safe entry into the sport. It is starting point of a very long journey. To think that instruction will guarantee protection from oneself and others is ludicrous. Instruction will certainly allow for a lower risk of injury, but it is ultimately up to the individual to head the warnings explained at the beginning and choose wisely the conditions and locations in which they choose to kite and progress in the sport.

Once a student leaves the instructional environment, it is now our responsibilty to keep an eye out for the Rick Day's of the world and steer clear or keep them in check.

Randy has been a huge mentor to me. He helped get me into this great sport. He is a good friend and I wish him well with his venture with Best. However, I will never be able to catch up with in experience. I do know that my 15 years of teaching will serve me well as I introduce new folks to this wonderful sport. I do know with each student I will become wiser and more knowledgeable with my curriculum. I sincerely hope that each student will retain 100% of what they learned. A kid can fail a class and the result is an F. A kite student can fail and it may cost their life or someone else's.

I sincerely hope that in the future it will be required to attain a license or certification card in order to purchase gear. It still boggles my mind that anyone can purchase gear online and basically teach themselves. When that day comes, it will be a good day. Until then, ruffle the feathers. We all need to be asking questions and searching for answers. There is certainly nothing wrong with a healthy debate.

Oh yeah, I have been riding for one year. No injuries to date. No tangles. No kite repairs. From 10 knots to 30+ it has been a great year. I am proud that I don't have a kitemare to share. I have educated myself, been patient, and known my limits. I hope to share this philosophy of kiting with my future students.

See you on the water. Have fun tomorrow. We will be at Caladesi teaching lessons all day. Enjoy three less newbies in the water.

Steve-O

[tomstock]

Ok, thanks Steve-O. Best of luck with teaching. Thanks for the friendly debate.

[bryanleighty]

Is Randy riding for BEST now?

[BigR]

Oh yeah, for awhile now, he's a rep and has a shop to sell as well Cindy says

[Kamikazi]

Cerification, smertification...its more money making racket. Have you seen what they want to charge to get certify, $600 or more . There is no OFFICIALLY recognize certifing organization because certification is not regulated nor required, unlike SCUBA and other air sports. Yes, I know there are organizations, but they are not regulated. It's better to have someone willing to teach new riders rather than have people trying to learn on their own. I did it on my own and it took me 3 years to figure it out. I wish there was someone with a boat, willing to HELP me, let alone teach me. I'm lucky I didn't kill myself. I've been riding 6 years ( I don have no certification of any kind). Steve-O, I dont kno you, but if you have a boat or ski and are willing to teaching students away from other riders and OFF OF THE BEACH, then you will help our sport. Nothing is worse than a teacher, I don't care if it is Dimitri, yelling instructions at a student from the beach. I've seen it...it has been the norm for many years. As far as how long has Steve-O been riding, what does that have to do with anything. Have you seen what some of these kids have accomplished in a year. They ride for a year and are incredible. There are at least 10 little kids here in Miami, under 15, riding for a year thats awsome. Have fun, be safe respect others or get whats comin to you.

PAZ amigos
Jaime

[tomstock]

Yeah, those are good points and you a probably right. Better to have a few good instructors who are not certified than a few bad ones who are.